Where are the best clubs made?

On a slightly different tack to the usual forged blade v cast POS shovel, I thought I'd open up discussion on where clubs are made. As we all know, China makes almost everything these days, but as most of us here are club hoes, many of us own clubs that pre date the Chinese hostile takeover of the golf equipment manufacturing industry.

I'm talking mainly irons here, as from what I've read China is the only country where environmental laws are lax enough to allow the use of titanium in the manufacturing process.

My current irons are made in the US and I've noticed a step up in quality from the Chinese made crap I'd been using. I also used to won GFF which was made in Japan, and they were of a much higher quality than other forged clubs I've hit.

From my experience over the years, I'd say that Japan make the best forged irons (Mizuno, Miura etc), closely followed by the US when they still made them there (MacGregor, Hogan, Titleist), while for cast clubs the best are probably made in the US (Ping, Powerbilt, Titleist etc). From all the OEMs who used to make their clubs in the US, I think Powerbilt are the only ones that haven't caved yet.

We all know it is the Mizuno forged clubs that are forged in the burning embers of Mt. Fuji . . . . . . just as the Samurai swords of the years long past.

Dunlop Loco iron set, got them from Walmart with the John Daly bag 299.99 3 years ago took 4 strokes off my handicap.

G H D

Mizuno mx series gff clubs rule. they make the mp blade clubs for them boys with the vanity handicaps except for Sooner.

GHD

These days definately Japan. 20-30 years ago in the heyday of Wilson and Macgregor etc. American forgings were definately world leaders but those days unfortunately are gone. It is very fortunate for us equipment ho's and purists that Japan has taken over the mantle, and even lifted the bar IMO. My newly aquired Miura's are by far the most superbly crafted irons I have ever seen, or used.

[QUOTE=SoonerBS]We all know it is the Mizuno forged clubs that are forged in the burning embers of Mt. Fuji . . . . . . just as the Samurai swords of the years long past.[/QUOTE]

Sad to say, but not all. Some are forged in the melamine-ridden caves of China. The advantage of very cheap labour over there is simply too hard to resist.

[QUOTE=Not a hacker]On a slightly different tack to the usual forged blade v cast POS shovel, I thought I'd open up discussion on where clubs are made. As we all know, China makes almost everything these days, but as most of us here are club hoes, many of us own clubs that pre date the Chinese hostile takeover of the golf equipment manufacturing industry.

I'm talking mainly irons here, as from what I've read China is the only country where environmental laws are lax enough to allow the use of titanium in the manufacturing process.

My current irons are made in the US and I've noticed a step up in quality from the Chinese made crap I'd been using. I also used to won GFF which was made in Japan, and they were of a much higher quality than other forged clubs I've hit.

From my experience over the years, I'd say that Japan make the best forged irons (Mizuno, Miura etc), closely followed by the US when they still made them there (MacGregor, Hogan, [B]Titleist[/B]), while for cast clubs the best are probably made in the US (Ping, Powerbilt, Titleist etc). From all the OEMs who used to make their clubs in the US, I think Powerbilt are the only ones that haven't caved yet.[/QUOTE]

I thought Titleist products are sourced from Chinese caves?

[QUOTE=oldplayer]These days definately Japan. 20-30 years ago in the heyday of Wilson and Macgregor etc. American forgings were definately world leaders but those days unfortunately are gone. It is very fortunate for us equipment ho's and purists that Japan has taken over the mantle, and even lifted the bar IMO. My newly aquired Miura's are by far the most superbly crafted irons I have ever seen, or used.[/QUOTE]

I agree with you and NaH. Japan these days probably have the best forgings or the few American clubmakers left. Looking at old MacGregors fromt he 1980s and prior were gold. Are there any small botique clubmakers in the UK or Spain or some other golfing power in Europe?

Scratch takes oversized head blanks forged in Japan, then does the custom grinds, stamping, finishing, and paintfills in the US.

[url]http://scratchgolf.com/about-us/scratch-golf-faqs/[/url]

I have a Mizuno MP-14 4-iron, an MS-11 5-iron, and MP-11 6-iron, and an MP-33 6-iron. All are great, but just as great, for both feel and accuracy, are my '82 Powerbilt Super Citations which, perhaps coincidentally, were marketed in Japan. Incidentally, I find the non-cambered sole of the MS-11 particularly helpful. I think that this should be mandated in the new health bill under "wellness programs."

Where are my 06 Hogan Apex Edge weapons forged? I was assuming here in the US, but maybe in Mount Doom, Mordor, Middle Earth??

mentaloaf,
the stickers that you pulled off youre clubs that said Thailand would be a good start.

[QUOTE=connecticutter]I agree with you and NaH. Japan these days probably have the best forgings or the few American clubmakers left. Looking at old MacGregors fromt he 1980s and prior were gold. Are there any small botique clubmakers in the UK or Spain or some other golfing power in Europe?[/QUOTE]

I don't shop at small botiques.

This is an important topic NAH.

I propose a GR ban on all Chinese made golf products. Their quality is usually poor, their consistency is terrible (meaning they aren't even universally bad, but have different levels of bad), they have very poor work standards, poor environmental standards, and have an artificially undervalued currency.

I have been trying to research the country of origin for different brands and its very difficult. Mizuno is clearly Japanese, and TM, Adams, and Callaway are all Chinese. Ping seems to be partially USA made and partially Chinese made, but I can't find a breakdown on which products come from where. I am also unsure how much Titliest produces outside of China, but I don't think it is much.

Manufacturing in general, is practically non existent in the USA. It will be interesting to see how things shake out if China's currency value goes up to where it should be. I doubt people will be willing to pay a premium price for poor quality products.

[QUOTE=The Purist]This is an important topic NAH.

I propose a GR ban on all Chinese made golf products. Their quality is usually poor, their consistency is terrible (meaning they aren't even universally bad, but have different levels of bad), they have very poor work standards, poor environmental standards, and have an artificially undervalued currency.

I have been trying to research the country of origin for different brands and its very difficult. Mizuno is clearly Japanese, and TM, Adams, and Callaway are all Chinese. Ping seems to be partially USA made and partially Chinese made, but I can't find a breakdown on which products come from where. I am also unsure how much Titliest produces outside of China, but I don't think it is much.

Manufacturing in general, is practically non existent in the USA. It will be interesting to see how things shake out if China's currency value goes up to where it should be. I doubt people will be willing to pay a premium price for poor quality products.[/QUOTE]

Mizuno has also club manufacturing facilities in China.

Before I got into golf I was into cycling.The same type of debate happened about 10-12 years ago.The purists believed steel was the only to go.The established companies all had adds with an old Italian man brazing a steel frame in an old shop.The add would say something like Brand A bicycles the quality your training demands.The marketing had you believe this top quality item was just for you.Much the same as Mizuno's marketing.You rarely see a new steel frame bike anymore.Carbon fiber frames,even though mass produced go faster.So with golf even though a lot of the foundries are overseas,the buyers(big golf co.) have quality control people to ensure everything is OK.My next purchase will be a set of wedges.I will probably go with Scratch cast wedges.Where the blank comes from...I don't care.I believe the people at Scratch know what they are doing and the steel will be as soft,the grooves as precise,the grinds better than any OEM.Maybe I've fallen for Scratch's "made just for you marketing",but I like the fact that my money is paying for a skilled worker (grinder) in North America.

[QUOTE=Mizuno>Ping]I thought Titleist products are sourced from Chinese caves?[/QUOTE]
I was going back a few years, obviously now all their stuff is cheap crap, especially their putters.

Funny how none of the OEMs passed on a y of the savings when they moved their manufacturing off shore to China. Despite the drop in quality and costs, greedy OEMs still continue to jack up the prices. Ping's S57 iron being made in China but selling in shops in Oz for over $200 a club was the final straw. I honestly think the best way to go is to get good second hand clubs on ebay that fit your specs. It sometimes means waiting for the right clubs to come along, but in the end you will get a better quality set than anything new (outside Japanese forgings), and for about 20% of the cost of the new crap (obviously I'm talking ironshere. Drivers are all made in China, and you can still get some good putters made in the US).

I also suport TP's call for a ban on all Chinese made products. This won't affect the ban on Titleist equipment as their stuff is all Chinese.

[QUOTE=Not a hacker]Funny how none of the OEMs passed on a y of the savings when they moved their manufacturing off shore to China. Despite the drop in quality and costs, greedy OEMs still continue to jack up the prices. Ping's S57 iron being made in China but selling in shops in Oz for over $200 a club was the final straw. [B][U]I honestly think the best way to go is to get good second hand clubs on ebay that fit your specs[/U][/B]. It sometimes means waiting for the right clubs to come along, but in the end you will get a better quality set than anything new (outside Japanese forgings), and for about 20% of the cost of the new crap (obviously I'm talking ironshere. Drivers are all made in China, and you can still get some good putters made in the US).

I also suport TP's call for a ban on all Chinese made products. This won't affect the ban on Titleist equipment as their stuff is all Chinese.[/QUOTE]

I wholeheartedly agree and have done exactly this myself. I have been saying this since I first started posting here. Although only about iron sets.
You can get fantastic quality American and Japanese forgings which absolutely sh!t on the crap coming out of China for so little it's like stealing.
These clubs are not taken seriously because of their vintage, but they are authentic golf clubs, made to an ideal of quality and performance; and not the lastest crap that is made only to turn a quick buck from the gulible punters. Most of these beautiful irons can be had for between $50 and $200.