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  1. #1
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    I may limit practice to just putts and chips

    I don't know if anyone else is this way but I tend to hit my driver and irons much better if I don't practice them. I may hit 6 or 7 balls on the range just to warm up prior to playing but I'm not working on anything. On the other hand, I tend to hit my chips and putts much better if I do a little practicing before I play.

    Whenever I go to the range for the specific purpose of hitting my driver or irons it always screws up my swing. I do much better if I stay away from the range and hit the chipping area instead.

  2. #2
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    I think its vital to practice chipping and putting on the practice green of the course before you play it because every day is different. Even a course you've played 100 times. It never takes me long to get the green speed dialed in and hopefully the degree of bounce and roll-out on chips and pitches. Regarding the full shots with the long clubs, as long as I'm warmed up, I can go hit a driver off the first tee and it will be OK 90% of the time. Now as far as a second shot with a fairway wood, long iron or hybrid, that's a different story and I do better with those if I've hit some full shots on the range. This should be better for me this season because I've shafted every club in my bag so they all play lighter and easier except for the new driver I got which is real lightweight with an easy feeling shaft that I should be able to bust in my sleep.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel
    I think its vital to practice chipping and putting on the practice green of the course before you play it because every day is different. Even a course you've played 100 times. It never takes me long to get the green speed dialed in and hopefully the degree of bounce and roll-out on chips and pitches. Regarding the full shots with the long clubs, as long as I'm warmed up, I can go hit a driver off the first tee and it will be OK 90% of the time. Now as far as a second shot with a fairway wood, long iron or hybrid, that's a different story and I do better with those if I've hit some full shots on the range. This should be better for me this season because I've shafted every club in my bag so they all play lighter and easier except for the new driver I got which is real lightweight with an easy feeling shaft that I should be able to bust in my sleep.
    You must play at the rare course that has it's practice greens the same as the course greens. I haven't had that pleasure yet. Ever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yaz1975
    You must play at the rare course that has it's practice greens the same as the course greens. I haven't had that pleasure yet. Ever.
    With one or two exceptions, every public and private course I've ever played in memory since 1955 with a practice green or greens have been similar to those on the course unless Carl (or Carlos) neglected to do his daily service mow on the practice facility. Now there's usually a couple of greens on every course that play differently due to sun and wind exposure, elevation, and drainage but 99% of the time they are all planted with the same grass, aerated at the same time, fertilized at the same time, rolled at the same time, and constructed the same. Unless the greenskeeper is playing a mind game with tournament contestants by keeping the practice green higher or lower than the course, it makes no sense to adjust cutting height for the different greens.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel
    With one or two exceptions, every public and private course I've ever played in memory since 1955 with a practice green or greens have been similar to those on the course unless Carl (or Carlos) neglected to do his daily service mow on the practice facility. Now there's usually a couple of greens on every course that play differently due to sun and wind exposure, elevation, and drainage but 99% of the time they are all planted with the same grass, aerated at the same time, fertilized at the same time, rolled at the same time, and constructed the same. Unless the greenskeeper is playing a mind game with tournament contestants by keeping the practice green higher or lower than the course, it makes no sense to adjust cutting height for the different greens.
    I agree. Most of the courses I've played in my life have greens on the course that are similar to the practice greens. Of course, I play quality courses and not some 9-hole executive hacker course.

  6. #6
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    I find at quality courses where proper maintenence is done the practice putting greens are often faster than the ones on the course. I have always put this down to the fact they get a lot of use and traffic so get very hard and firm. Just a guess.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    I find at quality courses where proper maintenence is done the practice putting greens are often faster than the ones on the course. I have always put this down to the fact they get a lot of use and traffic so get very hard and firm. Just a guess.
    Well, OP, I've gone and done it again. I saw a set of Cobra S2 Forged irons on Craigslist and just had to get them. The basically look new with having been played about 3 times. I paid $280 for them and I threw in a dozen Callaway Tour i(s) balls (which I really didn't like anyway). Can't wait to try these out. They've got the stock Nippon S shafts in them.

  8. #8
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    Good buy. Cobra irons seem to hold their value better than most. Perhaps their model turnover is not as great as some like taylormade. They still sell on ebay around $400 in mint condition (best price) so you have done well. I was curious when they were released as they looked to have all the attributes a better player wants along with forgivness. I also though the stock nippons was a good way to go. I only got as far as hitting them at the range although if I could have got a good price I may have pulled the trigger.
    My impressions, although only hitting the 6 iron were.
    Nice feeling although not that butter soft I prefer.
    Feedback was a little lacking.
    Ballflight was a bit high. don't know if that was the nippons or the low cog of the heads.
    Topline a bit thick but then again all irons I have seen in this catagory are like this.
    Look good overall and set up pretty well.
    All in all I thought they were good but not great.
    In the same catagory I thought the mizuno mx 300 were the better club.
    I am now playing with my KZG Evolutions with rifle 5.0 flighted and find in them the perfect set of irons for me. My only small critisims would be the 9 and pw heads seem a little large.
    This set has put a stop to my hoing, for how long I don't know. I really like these evo's and bought this set new, and custom built for me. So far I am playing well with them and have come down to 3.9 cap. So they haven't hurt my game. I think these are as good or better than any I have played so I will try and stick with them. Trouble is hoing is hard to cure. When you get the itch it is hard to fight.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    Good buy. Cobra irons seem to hold their value better than most. Perhaps their model turnover is not as great as some like taylormade. They still sell on ebay around $400 in mint condition (best price) so you have done well. I was curious when they were released as they looked to have all the attributes a better player wants along with forgivness. I also though the stock nippons was a good way to go. I only got as far as hitting them at the range although if I could have got a good price I may have pulled the trigger.
    My impressions, although only hitting the 6 iron were.
    Nice feeling although not that butter soft I prefer.
    Feedback was a little lacking.
    Ballflight was a bit high. don't know if that was the nippons or the low cog of the heads.
    Topline a bit thick but then again all irons I have seen in this catagory are like this.
    Look good overall and set up pretty well.
    All in all I thought they were good but not great.
    In the same catagory I thought the mizuno mx 300 were the better club.
    I am now playing with my KZG Evolutions with rifle 5.0 flighted and find in them the perfect set of irons for me. My only small critisims would be the 9 and pw heads seem a little large.
    This set has put a stop to my hoing, for how long I don't know. I really like these evo's and bought this set new, and custom built for me. So far I am playing well with them and have come down to 3.9 cap. So they haven't hurt my game. I think these are as good or better than any I have played so I will try and stick with them. Trouble is hoing is hard to cure. When you get the itch it is hard to fight.
    You are correct that it's hard to not get excited about pulling the trigger on new irons. What I do now is go on Craigslist or the used section of golf stores and I'll only buy them if I'm certain that I can resell them on Ebay for about $50 more. Craigslist is really the way to go because you can get amazing deals. I'm pretty sure I could sell these on Ebay right now for $375 or $400. After fees that's about $50 profit. Considering the effort involved in buying and selling them it's a wash but at least I'm not losing money.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    I don't know if anyone else is this way but I tend to hit my driver and irons much better if I don't practice them. I may hit 6 or 7 balls on the range just to warm up prior to playing but I'm not working on anything. On the other hand, I tend to hit my chips and putts much better if I do a little practicing before I play.

    Whenever I go to the range for the specific purpose of hitting my driver or irons it always screws up my swing. I do much better if I stay away from the range and hit the chipping area instead.
    If you're happy with the way you're hitting the ball and you're playing pretty regularly, then why should you practice, but...

    ...ISTM that the very best players in the world practice pretty religiously.

    Just something to think about.
    TaylorMade r7 9.5°
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    Cleveland 52°, Titleist Vokey 56° & 60°
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    You are correct that it's hard to not get excited about pulling the trigger on new irons. What I do now is go on Craigslist or the used section of golf stores and I'll only buy them if I'm certain that I can resell them on Ebay for about $50 more. Craigslist is really the way to go because you can get amazing deals. I'm pretty sure I could sell these on Ebay right now for $375 or $400. After fees that's about $50 profit. Considering the effort involved in buying and selling them it's a wash but at least I'm not losing money.
    Yes I have no trouble with buying, trying, and moving them on if necessary. I did that with my mx 300's. Bought them new on ebay from morton golf; played with them more than a month and then sold them for roughly $100 profit. The guy was happy. He was going to buy a set retail for nearly a grand. He got a mint set for $650. As you say it's all about buying at the right price.
    That's where my approach with the KZG was different. I did my research, a demo and then went ahead. No way i would get my money back on these. This was not the normal hoing for me.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    Yes I have no trouble with buying, trying, and moving them on if necessary. I did that with my mx 300's. Bought them new on ebay from morton golf; played with them more than a month and then sold them for roughly $100 profit. The guy was happy. He was going to buy a set retail for nearly a grand. He got a mint set for $650. As you say it's all about buying at the right price.
    That's where my approach with the KZG was different. I did my research, a demo and then went ahead. No way i would get my money back on these. This was not the normal hoing for me.
    I'm playing less golf these days and so I'm thinking about a set of KZG cavity backs but right now I'm playing the MP-32-s that way. How would you compare the two?
    GR lives...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    I'm playing less golf these days and so I'm thinking about a set of KZG cavity backs but right now I'm playing the MP-32-s that way. How would you compare the two?
    KZG have different models of cavity back so i can't comment on those but it is fair to say that the Evo's are the most popular and have stood the test of time as a model. They are really very different from the 32's. They are a mid-size head, although not as big as some in the mid-size catagory. They have a progressive offset that I personally like but is distinct all the same. They are much more forgiving then the 32's while still being a "players" cb. They are a genuine combo set. The long irons have higher ballflight than the 32's and the short irons have lower. this is a specific design feature of the evo's manipulated by the moving of the cog on the heads. The 32's cut muscle cog dosen't vary through the heads.
    The KZG are a true double struck Japanese forging (not saying mizuno are not) and have the butter soft solid feel i love. I got mine in Satin and the quality of finish of the heads is even better than mizuno. They are hand ground and the weight progression head to head is better than just about any head out there. This is quite a feat and a testiment to the quality of the product.
    So in short they are higher quality, more forgiving, better matched and a genuine combo set of irons for the better player. Although a mid capper could play these without too much trouble. As I said previously i have not played a better set.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    KZG have different models of cavity back so i can't comment on those but it is fair to say that the Evo's are the most popular and have stood the test of time as a model. They are really very different from the 32's. They are a mid-size head, although not as big as some in the mid-size catagory. They have a progressive offset that I personally like but is distinct all the same. They are much more forgiving then the 32's while still being a "players" cb. They are a genuine combo set. The long irons have higher ballflight than the 32's and the short irons have lower. this is a specific design feature of the evo's manipulated by the moving of the cog on the heads. The 32's cut muscle cog dosen't vary through the heads.
    The KZG are a true double struck Japanese forging (not saying mizuno are not) and have the butter soft solid feel i love. I got mine in Satin and the quality of finish of the heads is even better than mizuno. They are hand ground and the weight progression head to head is better than just about any head out there. This is quite a feat and a testiment to the quality of the product.
    So in short they are higher quality, more forgiving, better matched and a genuine combo set of irons for the better player. Although a mid capper could play these without too much trouble. As I said previously i have not played a better set.
    Yes, I meant the Evos. With the 32-s starting to wear out, I might give them a try.
    GR lives...

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    You are correct that it's hard to not get excited about pulling the trigger on new irons. What I do now is go on Craigslist or the used section of golf stores and I'll only buy them if I'm certain that I can resell them on Ebay for about $50 more. Craigslist is really the way to go because you can get amazing deals. I'm pretty sure I could sell these on Ebay right now for $375 or $400. After fees that's about $50 profit. Considering the effort involved in buying and selling them it's a wash but at least I'm not losing money.
    When I want a deal on clubs, I go to the local Golf Galaxy. Last week I got a real clean set of Titleist 755's, 3-PW, for $125. The guy who traded them in had just put new Black Widow grips on them. I was looking for a set of forged cavity backs as a second set but after I pulled the Tri Spec shafts and put Dynalite Gold Sl's in them, they are looking like the go to irons. A day or two later I went into that store to get some balls and they had a pristine 907D2 in 10.5* with a Diamana Blue 63g. regular flex--the factory shaft, not the "made for Titleist" for $57. Hell, the head with hosel would sell for a good bit more than that on Ebay. And that completed my Titleist bore-through collection. You can't get stuff that cheap on Craigslist near me.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel
    When I want a deal on clubs, I go to the local Golf Galaxy. Last week I got a real clean set of Titleist 755's, 3-PW, for $125. The guy who traded them in had just put new Black Widow grips on them. I was looking for a set of forged cavity backs as a second set but after I pulled the Tri Spec shafts and put Dynalite Gold Sl's in them, they are looking like the go to irons. A day or two later I went into that store to get some balls and they had a pristine 907D2 in 10.5* with a Diamana Blue 63g. regular flex--the factory shaft, not the "made for Titleist" for $57. Hell, the head with hosel would sell for a good bit more than that on Ebay. And that completed my Titleist bore-through collection. You can't get stuff that cheap on Craigslist near me.
    Golf Galaxy is by far the cheapest for used clubs. I forgot to mention them but you are absolutely correct. One time I went in there and they had 25% off the used stuff. I bought a near new set of Titleist 735 irons for $90. I once bought a set of Ping Eye 2 Plus irons in new condition for $119, 3-LW and turned around and sold them 7 days later for $375. The other day I saw a set of Callway X Tours for $115. $57 for a Titleist D2 driver is amazing.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    Yes I have no trouble with buying, trying, and moving them on if necessary. I did that with my mx 300's. Bought them new on ebay from morton golf; played with them more than a month and then sold them for roughly $100 profit. The guy was happy. He was going to buy a set retail for nearly a grand. He got a mint set for $650. As you say it's all about buying at the right price.
    That's where my approach with the KZG was different. I did my research, a demo and then went ahead. No way i would get my money back on these. This was not the normal hoing for me.
    Did you just purchase the KZG irons or did you do that awhile back?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    Did you just purchase the KZG irons or did you do that awhile back?
    About a month ago. I have played a dozen rounds or more and took them with me on my recent golfing trip.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  19. #19
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    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    About a month ago. I have played a dozen rounds or more and took them with me on my recent golfing trip.
    I went to the website to check them out. Looks like they have an Evolution Tour and then a regular version. Both look very nice. I really like the look of the Zero Offset. They remind me of the original Orlimar Forged blades. Clean and simple. Those Evolutions look much better than the Mizuno MX-300. Not as good as my new Cobra S2 Forged irons.

  20. #20
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    another good session with the ISI green dots today... VERY good.. getting the right posture down, the right rhythm for the shafts.. and I only hit about ten drivers, just enough to keep the feel... LOTS of short wedges, hit the 100 sign three times out of seven swings... :-)

    Hit the 50 sign twice but that one is much easier to hit...

    one thing I can't do at the range is putt, and I really need to do that.

    GOOD GRIEF that Odyssey Backstrike mallet feels good. I can't STAND to pay retail though, and it's not old enough to be cheaper.
    Cleveland long clubs
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins
    another good session with the ISI green dots today... VERY good.. getting the right posture down, the right rhythm for the shafts.. and I only hit about ten drivers, just enough to keep the feel... LOTS of short wedges, hit the 100 sign three times out of seven swings... :-)

    Hit the 50 sign twice but that one is much easier to hit...

    one thing I can't do at the range is putt, and I really need to do that.

    GOOD GRIEF that Odyssey Backstrike mallet feels good. I can't STAND to pay retail though, and it's not old enough to be cheaper.
    That's not a good thing when you're swinging a 3 iron.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    I find at quality courses where proper maintenence is done the practice putting greens are often faster than the ones on the course. I have always put this down to the fact they get a lot of use and traffic so get very hard and firm. Just a guess.
    This. I rarely find the speed of the practice green to match the speed of the greens on the course.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    That's not a good thing when you're swinging a 3 iron.
    maybe a punch three iron? under the wind?

    actually I was putting.
    Cleveland long clubs
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yaz1975
    This. I rarely find the speed of the practice green to match the speed of the greens on the course.
    Unless it's a really damp green, I do not even notice (or care for) the speed of the green. I mix it up alot with different putters so I constantly adjust from day to day. I WILL have a day that is realy bad once in a while but its all me and not the green speed or the putter.
    When I first started driving a car any other car's gas pedal, brake pedal or even the road surface felt different. Eventually I drove many rental cars, fuel trucks, and airplanes and found that the human mind adjusts to differences and soon these differences make little difference.
    ... a tree branch, or my foot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetdriver
    Unless it's a really damp green, I do not even notice (or care for) the speed of the green. I mix it up alot with different putters so I constantly adjust from day to day. I WILL have a day that is realy bad once in a while but its all me and not the green speed or the putter.
    When I first started driving a car any other car's gas pedal, brake pedal or even the road surface felt different. Eventually I drove many rental cars, fuel trucks, and airplanes and found that the human mind adjusts to differences and soon these differences make little difference.
    Except for the first green. You walk on that one to putt, and it's a crap shoot. You don't have any other green to compare to except the practice green. So there's a very good chance you leave it shot or whiz it by. Same with driving a new car, the first few minutes is going to have to be a learning period until you get the hang of those particular characteristics. So given that comparison, you may not get the feel for them until the 2nd or even 3rd green. And by then, you could have already thrown up some big numbers with the flat stick.

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