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  1. #1
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    John Feinstein needs a tissue

    I just received this month's issue of Golf Digest. Toward the back of the magazine is an article where John Feinstein goes into detail about his shaky relationship with Tiger Woods. Basically, in a nutshell, when Tiger first came on the scene back in 1994 and then again in 1996, John Feinstein wrote several articles criticizing Earl Woods for being so vocal and trying to get endorsement deals for Tiger. He also wrote several articles criticizing Tiger for turning down a dinner invite with President Clinton and then skipping the Buick Invitational, after he was sent a sponsor's exemption. Tiger and he met for a drink and discussed things and Feinstein told Tiger that he was coming out with a new book that openly criticized Earl Woods and was pretty harsh. Tiger later read the book and has had a cold relationship with Feinstein ever since.

    The article, in this month's Golf Digest, is very telling in that it reveals how self absorbed and petty John Feinstein really is. He repeats over and over how other pros would tell Tiger that Feinstein is a trustworthy guy or "a good guy". He acts like Tiger let him down and didn't show any class. Fact: Feinstein talked sh@t about Earl Woods all the time. Why would Tiger want to be friendly and give interviews with someone who did that so openly? Furthermore, in the magazine article Feinstein makes it very clear that Tiger was very cordial to him whenever they passed one another and had agreed to meet him for lunch to discuss things. The discussion didn't go Feinstein's way and he's been a sourpuss ever since.

    In 1997 Tiger Woods was invited to have dinner with President Clinton and Jacky Robinson's wife. He turned it down. You know why he turned it down? Because Tiger saw through the BS. He was only invited AFTER he won the Masters. Not before. Why should he go put on the token black man dog and pony show for Bill Clinton? I had forgotten about that story but even then I couldn't understand why people were upset at Tiger. I wouldn't have gone either. Gee, you get to meet President Clinton.

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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis View Post
    Fact: Feinstein talked sh@t about Earl Woods all the time.
    I have a problem with this formulation. In black lingo, "talking ****" is simply a euphemism for "criticize." It gets used indiscriminately any time some heavily muscled goof with an ego like Steuben Glass needs to deflect attention from something he's done wrong. Part of this is generational, of course, all young people being infected with "I'm perfect" disease, but most of it is just "white people are not allowed to talk to me."

    That said, I always wondered whether John Feinstein ever got laid in college.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 24putts View Post
    I have a problem with this formulation. In black lingo, "talking ****" is simply a euphemism for "criticize." It gets used indiscriminately any time some heavily muscled goof with an ego like Steuben Glass needs to deflect attention from something he's done wrong. Part of this is generational, of course, all young people being infected with "I'm perfect" disease, but most of it is just "white people are not allowed to talk to me."

    That said, I always wondered whether John Feinstein ever got laid in college.

    I agree and I shouldn't have written it that way. I would replace it with "heavily criticized". Either way I think Feinstein had a problem with Tiger's confidence and his tendency to do things his own way in regard to autographs, participating in tournaments, interviews, etc. The truth is that Tiger Woods never does anything he doesn't want to do and makes all of his own choices. Some have been very bad. In the end, though, it was his choice and most people can't say that about themselves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis View Post
    I agree and I shouldn't have written it that way. I would replace it with "heavily criticized". Either way I think Feinstein had a problem with Tiger's confidence and his tendency to do things his own way in regard to autographs, participating in tournaments, interviews, etc. The truth is that Tiger Woods never does anything he doesn't want to do and makes all of his own choices. Some have been very bad. In the end, though, it was his choice and most people can't say that about themselves.
    I disagree with just about everything in this post. To me, his confidence (off the golf course, his is supremely confident on the course) looks shallow, more like insecurity masked by being aloof. He reminds of the guy who can get away with about 30 seconds of scripted conversation before getting nervous and sh!tting his pants.
    I also don't get the impression that he is calling the shots. Every single thing about him, from the minute he wakes up to the minute he goes to sleep, is managed by handlers looking to protect their cash cow. He probably rebeled against his stifling life by breaking a few societal rules, like cheating on his spouse.
    Have you ever actually heard Tiger speak his mind and give an unscripted answer? I haven't. I get the impression the he is not a very mature person, and not very comfortable in his own skin.
    Go ahead and like the guy's golf game, but he is not a very admirable public person. Maybe he's a great guy among his friends, but he is shallow and boring in the the public eye.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horseballs View Post
    I disagree with just about everything in this post. To me, his confidence (off the golf course, his is supremely confident on the course) looks shallow, more like insecurity masked by being aloof. He reminds of the guy who can get away with about 30 seconds of scripted conversation before getting nervous and sh!tting his pants.
    I also don't get the impression that he is calling the shots. Every single thing about him, from the minute he wakes up to the minute he goes to sleep, is managed by handlers looking to protect their cash cow. He probably rebeled against his stifling life by breaking a few societal rules, like cheating on his spouse.
    Have you ever actually heard Tiger speak his mind and give an unscripted answer? I haven't. I get the impression the he is not a very mature person, and not very comfortable in his own skin.
    Go ahead and like the guy's golf game, but he is not a very admirable public person. Maybe he's a great guy among his friends, but he is shallow and boring in the the public eye.

    I disagree with just about everything you posted about my post. It's pretty obvious that Tiger calls his own shots and is NOT handled by anyone. He's fired caddies, agents and told his dad to back off and let him handle things himself. You think his sponsors tell him how to answer his post round interviews? Nobody would want him to answer the way he does. I don't think he listens to anyone but himself, his coach and maybe his agent and even that is done on his terms. I don't think he has that many people in his life.

    He has veto power. If you do something to screw with him he'll make sure your career is over, like the guy who did the Rolling Stone interview. Feinstein is mad because Tiger never allowed him to enter his world. He's done that to many people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Horseballs View Post
    I disagree with just about everything in this post. To me, his confidence (off the golf course, his is supremely confident on the course) looks shallow, more like insecurity masked by being aloof. He reminds of the guy who can get away with about 30 seconds of scripted conversation before getting nervous and sh!tting his pants.
    I also don't get the impression that he is calling the shots. Every single thing about him, from the minute he wakes up to the minute he goes to sleep, is managed by handlers looking to protect their cash cow. He probably rebeled against his stifling life by breaking a few societal rules, like cheating on his spouse.
    Have you ever actually heard Tiger speak his mind and give an unscripted answer? I haven't. I get the impression the he is not a very mature person, and not very comfortable in his own skin.
    Go ahead and like the guy's golf game, but he is not a very admirable public person. Maybe he's a great guy among his friends, but he is shallow and boring in the the public eye.
    I think you are spot on. Underneath the stage managed persona is an insecure guy. The banging skanks, the fist pumps, the roided body, thr aloofness are all cprnsations for his insecurities picked up in childhood. Under all the bravado is the same skinny nerd who couldnt get laid and got stood over for his lunch money.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker View Post
    I think you are spot on. Underneath the stage managed persona is an insecure guy. The banging skanks, the fist pumps, the roided body, thr aloofness are all cprnsations for his insecurities picked up in childhood. Under all the bravado is the same skinny nerd who couldnt get laid and got stood over for his lunch money.
    How is it a stage managed persona if he's been doing the fist pumps since he was in high school? Since when does banging skanks equate to insecurity? You have no proof of steroids and I'd expect a little more from you on that one. Now you're acting like some teenage girl gossiping with her friends.

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    The entire time Tiger's been in the public eye it's been obvious he feels socially awkward and insecure.. The Jim Nancies covered for him but his inferiority complex and over-compensation are hard to miss. This is not uncommon with driven people who were awkward and nerdy when young.

    Does anyone really pay any attention to what John Feinstein has to say?
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    I think it's pretty obvious that all of you are conspiring to disagree with me! How could that many people disagree with my logical posts!

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    Thanks for posting this FD. I only get Golf Magazine since I've puposely limited my magazine expenses. Now that I know Tiger refused an invite to the Clinton White House, my opinion of him has risen immensely. After I read that Clinton had spent a couple of days at Norman's place in Florida where Clinton slipped and messed up a knee, I immediately thought a lot less of Norman. I had a golf buddy who was flown to play golf a couple of times on Air Force Two when Dan Quayle was VP. All that was Earl's influence and also his dominating manner since Tiger was born lead to Tiger's insecurity in any setting besides a golf course. In effect, his maturation process was slowed immensely by the Pavlovian golf training he endured as a kid. Regardless of his millions, world-wide acclaim and oodles of toys, there is a price that was, is and will be paid forever and ever. Amen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel View Post
    Thanks for posting this FD. I only get Golf Magazine since I've puposely limited my magazine expenses. Now that I know Tiger refused an invite to the Clinton White House, my opinion of him has risen immensely. After I read that Clinton had spent a couple of days at Norman's place in Florida where Clinton slipped and messed up a knee, I immediately thought a lot less of Norman. I had a golf buddy who was flown to play golf a couple of times on Air Force Two when Dan Quayle was VP. All that was Earl's influence and also his dominating manner since Tiger was born lead to Tiger's insecurity in any setting besides a golf course. In effect, his maturation process was slowed immensely by the Pavlovian golf training he endured as a kid. Regardless of his millions, world-wide acclaim and oodles of toys, there is a price that was, is and will be paid forever and ever. Amen.
    I dunno, maybe he could have got it on with Monica Lewinsky and saved Bill all that trouble?
    I chose the road less traveled.

    Now where the f#ck am I?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi Player View Post
    I dunno, maybe he could have got it on with Monica Lewinsky and saved Bill all that trouble?
    Every Tigerskank photo I've seem portrays better women than Monica Lewinsky. Hell, Clinton wouldn't even f*ck her. What does that tell you?

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    Read this yesterday. There is ZERO doubt, Earl put the kibosh on Tiger's talks with Feinstein. Nobody says after five months "I just can't get past the thing that I was past five months ago".
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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel View Post
    Every Tigerskank photo I've seem portrays better women than Monica Lewinsky. Hell, Clinton wouldn't even f*ck her. What does that tell you?
    That's only so he could say "I did NOT have sexual relations with that woman" during his impeachment proceedings.

    Anyway it's not like Tiger is particularly choosy.
    I chose the road less traveled.

    Now where the f#ck am I?

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    I don't know, I'd probably do her . . . . . but then I'm not as picky as the rest of you bastages.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel View Post
    Every Tigerskank photo I've seem portrays better women than Monica Lewinsky. Hell, Clinton wouldn't even f*ck her. What does that tell you?
    Bill said she had the whitest teeth he's ever come across.
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis View Post
    How is it a stage managed persona if he's been doing the fist pumps since he was in high school? Since when does banging skanks equate to insecurity? You have no proof of steroids and I'd expect a little more from you on that one. Now you're acting like some teenage girl gossiping with her friends.
    The stage managed persona isnt related to the fist pumps. It was the carefully constructed 'family man' image i was referring to. Zo explained the insecurity compensations.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc View Post
    The entire time Tiger's been in the public eye it's been obvious he feels socially awkward and insecure.. The Jim Nancies covered for him but his inferiority complex and over-compensation are hard to miss. This is not uncommon with driven people who were awkward and nerdy when young.

    Does anyone really pay any attention to what John Feinstein has to say?
    Exactly what I thought. I saw the article and kept turning the pages. Why waste your time reading it?

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    FD, is the only one that gets it.

    There isn't one decent coach or quarterback in the NFL that isn't just as boring as Tiger. Any person with half a brain knows that its best to speak as neutral and bland as possible..."one shot (game) at a time", "I'm happy with my (our) effort", "I think I have a shot if I can get it going tomorrow". Tiger is just using coach speak...its a proven strategy for handling the media.

    Lets examine Tiger's affairs: When most of us were partying and hooking up with women during our high school & college years, Tiger was out practicing 10 hours a day. Could you imagine having the world at your feet at the age of 30 something, and realizing you never went through the promiscuous stage. Tiger was just trying to recapture some of his lost youth.

    Tiger is the greatest golfer to ever live. What made him so great? Was it always Tiger's dream to change the world or was it something more basic? I think what drove Tiger was the desire to to garner his father's approval. His father's dreams were so big and grand, that no amount of success seemed enough to match expectations. Earl's insatiable goals are what kept Tiger grounded and hungry. Earl's death was hard on Tiger. He eventually became impressed with himself and lost focus. Things continued to spiral out of control until he hit rock bottom.

    Had Tiger fallen apart after achieving his ultimate goal of 20+ majors, he may have never recovered. But as luck would have it, Tiger has become refocused on his goals and improved his swing and lifestyle.

    Tiger isn't insecure, he's not shallow, and he certainly isn't being handled or guided by anyone. Tiger is on a quest to fulfill Earl's vision for him, and nothing will stand in his way. The phoenix has risen.
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    Tiger doesn't usually play the tournament in Phoenix.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Purist View Post
    FD, is the only one that gets it.

    There isn't one decent coach or quarterback in the NFL that isn't just as boring as Tiger. Any person with half a brain knows that its best to speak as neutral and bland as possible..."one shot (game) at a time", "I'm happy with my (our) effort", "I think I have a shot if I can get it going tomorrow". Tiger is just using coach speak...its a proven strategy for handling the media.

    Lets examine Tiger's affairs: When most of us were partying and hooking up with women during our high school & college years, Tiger was out practicing 10 hours a day. Could you imagine having the world at your feet at the age of 30 something, and realizing you never went through the promiscuous stage. Tiger was just trying to recapture some of his lost youth.

    Tiger is the greatest golfer to ever live. What made him so great? Was it always Tiger's dream to change the world or was it something more basic? I think what drove Tiger was the desire to to garner his father's approval. His father's dreams were so big and grand, that no amount of success seemed enough to match expectations. Earl's insatiable goals are what kept Tiger grounded and hungry. Earl's death was hard on Tiger. He eventually became impressed with himself and lost focus. Things continued to spiral out of control until he hit rock bottom.

    Had Tiger fallen apart after achieving his ultimate goal of 20+ majors, he may have never recovered. But as luck would have it, Tiger has become refocused on his goals and improved his swing and lifestyle.

    Tiger isn't insecure, he's not shallow, and he certainly isn't being handled or guided by anyone. Tiger is on a quest to fulfill Earl's vision for him, and nothing will stand in his way. The phoenix has risen.
    You make a strong argument, but i still think he has hidden some major personality flaws over the years. But its not his fault. The world wants their heroes to be perfect and virtuous in every way, so he has been put on a pedestal he probably had no desire to be put on. I agree he is the greatest thing to ever happen to the game and will go down in history as the biggest sports star ever. I dont condemn him for his flaws. I actually think they make him more human and more likeable.
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis View Post
    Tiger doesn't usually play the tournament in Phoenix.
    The one in Phoenix is unimportant. Tiger doesn't play THE tournament in Scottsdale, Arizona and that one is the 5th major. He cannot be forgiven if he neglects it this year.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS View Post
    The one in Phoenix is unimportant. Tiger doesn't play THE tournament in Scottsdale, Arizona and that one is the 5th major. He cannot be forgiven if he neglects it this year.
    The one that has that stadium par 3 16th with the Animal House setting, that belongs to Phil. Tiger made a gentleman's agreement with Lefty to not play it so that Phil could get all the adoration on his home turf. Phil's contribution was to allow Tiger to escape wearing those silly pink ribbons. (Please note that I am neither disparaging the disease nor those who suffer from it but merely those who make such a bloody show of support and try to shame those who don't genuflect.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mongrel View Post
    The one that has that stadium par 3 16th with the Animal House setting, that belongs to Phil. Tiger made a gentleman's agreement with Lefty to not play it so that Phil could get all the adoration on his home turf. Phil's contribution was to allow Tiger to escape wearing those silly pink ribbons. (Please note that I am neither disparaging the disease nor those who suffer from it but merely those who make such a bloody show of support and try to shame those who don't genuflect.)

    didn't Tiger ace that thing one year? I"m confused. I know Phat Phil won it at age 19. I love the stadium hole and think every PGA tournament should have at least one spot on the course where the crowd can drunkenly jeer the players. Perhaps the 17th at Sawgrass, they could boo waterballs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins View Post
    didn't Tiger ace that thing one year? I"m confused. I know Phat Phil won it at age 19. I love the stadium hole and think every PGA tournament should have at least one spot on the course where the crowd can drunkenly jeer the players. Perhaps the 17th at Sawgrass, they could boo waterballs.
    They had one at the oz open for a few years til allenby got it banned after incessant whining. but not before the fans gave it to him for being such a sook. there were screams of get out of the hole as he stood over putts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker View Post
    They had one at the oz open for a few years til allenby got it banned after incessant whining. but not before the fans gave it to him for being such a sook. there were screams of get out of the hole as he stood over putts.
    reminds me of the tournament about six years ago where Vijay Singh was addressing the ball on an iron shot to the 18th for a win and some drunk in the crowd shouts at the top of his lungs "hit it in the water Vijay!" One of the things that contributed to Vijay's famously bad mood, his sense of victimhood about racism or whatever.
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins View Post
    reminds me of the tournament about six years ago where Vijay Singh was addressing the ball on an iron shot to the 18th for a win and some drunk in the crowd shouts at the top of his lungs "hit it in the water Vijay!" One of the things that contributed to Vijay's famously bad mood, his sense of victimhood about racism or whatever.
    I guess nobody likes a cheat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins View Post
    didn't Tiger ace that thing one year? I"m confused. I know Phat Phil won it at age 19. I love the stadium hole and think every PGA tournament should have at least one spot on the course where the crowd can drunkenly jeer the players. Perhaps the 17th at Sawgrass, they could boo waterballs.
    Those two par 3's won't be complete until they install the windmills.

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