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Thread: swing question

  1. #1
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    swing question

    Ok, drawing the ball is not my ball flight, but it's the way I want to hit the ball. Every course I play at seems to play in the right handers slice, or a left handers draw. I can draw the ball off the tee with a driver no problem, but my irons are a different story. I'm always working with my swing trying to make it better. I know it sounds weird when I'm mid 70's with a fade, but I think my game could improve alot playing a draw with my irons.

    But I don't think drawing the ball my natural ball flight. I'm left handed, but instead of my left hand being nt, my right hand is my nt hand.

    this is why I think my right hand leads my swing which causes me to open my face slightly, resulting in a fade.

    Looking for some tips from some experienced golfers on how I can draw the ball.

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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    Ok, drawing the ball is not my ball flight, but it's the way I want to hit the ball. Every course I play at seems to play in the right handers slice, or a left handers draw. I can draw the ball off the tee with a driver no problem, but my irons are a different story. I'm always working with my swing trying to make it better. I know it sounds weird when I'm mid 70's with a fade, but I think my game could improve alot playing a draw with my irons.

    But I don't think drawing the ball my natural ball flight. I'm left handed, but instead of my left hand being nt, my right hand is my nt hand.

    this is why I think my right hand leads my swing which causes me to open my face slightly, resulting in a fade.

    Looking for some tips from some experienced golfers on how I can draw the ball.

    Stick to what you feel comfortable with, drawing the irons wont really make a idfference.

    But if you want to my tip would be try and feel like you are dropping your hands into your pocket in the down swing. The face might be due to a weak grip is this the case?
    Feels just like it should.

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    Line up with a closed stance and a closed clubface.

    With that said, you may be better off keeping the fade. It's a safer shot, and fade mistakes are generally safer than draw/hook mistakes.
    Please, just call me Schemp...

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    Quote Originally Posted by bdcrowe
    Line up with a closed stance and a closed clubface.

    With that said, you may be better off keeping the fade. It's a safer shot, and fade mistakes are generally safer than draw/hook mistakes.

    I did the opposite. I've always hit a draw and I went to a fade. Like was mentioned, a fade is a lot more consistent and errors aren't usually as bad. I've found this to be true as well. If I still need to hit a big draw off the tee for added distance I can do it, but having that high fade land softly is much easier to predict. Just my opinion.

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    But a high draw is the most perfect shot in golf....I wanna hit that shot everytime..

    Another reason I don't like the fade is because, I dont line up right for it, I have a closed stance, which means I am already aiming left and from there I end up being more left.

    I'm losing my swing slowly....baseball is starting to take effect on my swing

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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    But a high draw is the most perfect shot in golf....I wanna hit that shot everytime..

    Another reason I don't like the fade is because, I dont line up right for it, I have a closed stance, which means I am already aiming left and from there I end up being more left.

    I'm losing my swing slowly....baseball is starting to take effect on my swing
    A high draw is a perfect shot in golf says who? Jack and Tiger played their best with controlled power fades, what does that say?

    Duh, if you're aiming left and you're know you're doing it correct it! What sense does that make, changing your whole ball flight based on a simple alignment issue is a bit drastic don't you think?

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    I'm not changin my swing to fit my stance and alignment.

    I'm changing to something thats more comfortable to me.

    to put it this way, i don't like to play a fade. It doesn't play well at 80% of the courses I have played in my golfing experience.

    who knows maybe I won't change my swing, Maybe I just need to practice more, maybe I have a kink in my swing....

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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    I'm not changin my swing to fit my stance and alignment.

    I'm changing to something thats more comfortable to me.
    I don't know why you asked this question Kirksey. In other posts you say you hit every club great. You say you want change your swing to what is more comfortable but you can't hit a draw right now, so how will it be more comfortable? Right now you hit a fade and you play well. Quit worrying about what is cool (draw) and stick with what works (fade).

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    Here is the easiest way to draw or fade the ball. If you want to hit a draw, set up a little right of the target to adjust for the draw. On the downswing you should swing and release your club a little right of the target. That will put draw spin on the ball. If you want to fade the ball do the opposite.

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    Let's go over this again.

    The new golf balls (not just the mega expensive ones) go about 20 times straighter than the old wound balls did.

    The new clubs (particularly hot faced woods, drivers, and utlilites) do not hold the ball on the clubface long enough to work it like was once possible.

    When you see people 'working; the ball you are most likely seeing their natural shot shape (everybody has one). It might draw a little. It might cut a little, but either way it is drawing and cutting much less than it owuld have with a wound ball and older equipment.

    Working the ball is over, done, finished. Working the ball now consisits basically of controlling the trajectory of a shot.

    Modern balls are not even affected much by the wind.

    If ANY golfer has a consistent ball flight that they can count on, and they carry their iron shots acceptable distance (I even consider 150 yards for a 7 iron acceptable) then they really are making the game much harder (and more elusive) by trying to change their flight or natural trajectory.

    Good luck with it, and live it up at the range. it won't work on the course though when you keep score. I promise that much.

    I hit my 7 iron 155 yards (flight) and I play long courses with no problems.
    The secret to golf is knowing how far and which direction the ball is going to go. Even if it is not going that far.

    Thanks for reading.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    But a high draw is the most perfect shot in golf....I wanna hit that shot everytime..

    Another reason I don't like the fade is because, I dont line up right for it, I have a closed stance, which means I am already aiming left and from there I end up being more left.

    I'm losing my swing slowly....baseball is starting to take effect on my swing
    Kirksey, baseball and golf are a BAD mix. One swing will surely screw up the other, and vice-versa. I know from experience, played baseball most of my life. You know how different the swings are. Are you plaing both sports now?
    "Always repair your divot."

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Besson
    Let's go over this again.

    The new golf balls (not just the mega expensive ones) go about 20 times straighter than the old wound balls did.

    The new clubs (particularly hot faced woods, drivers, and utlilites) do not hold the ball on the clubface long enough to work it like was once possible.

    When you see people 'working; the ball you are most likely seeing their natural shot shape (everybody has one). It might draw a little. It might cut a little, but either way it is drawing and cutting much less than it owuld have with a wound ball and older equipment.

    Working the ball is over, done, finished. Working the ball now consisits basically of controlling the trajectory of a shot.

    Modern balls are not even affected much by the wind.

    If ANY golfer has a consistent ball flight that they can count on, and they carry their iron shots acceptable distance (I even consider 150 yards for a 7 iron acceptable) then they really are making the game much harder (and more elusive) by trying to change their flight or natural trajectory.

    Good luck with it, and live it up at the range. it won't work on the course though when you keep score. I promise that much.

    I hit my 7 iron 155 yards (flight) and I play long courses with no problems.
    The secret to golf is knowing how far and which direction the ball is going to go. Even if it is not going that far.

    Thanks for reading.
    I disagree....all the best golfers in the world shape the shot excellently. I seen yesterday with Weir who hit cuts (on 9 and 17) and who also hit draws into the pins on many other holes like 14. The players who can shape shots will play the best in windy conditions and tight courses.

    Vijay and Ernie are exceptions to the rule. I wish every week had US Open rough to stop players like that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonMacIsaac
    I seen yesterday...
    At the risk of being a dick...remove that from your vocabulary. It makes you sound like an uneducated redneck hick from Northern Alberta.

    "I saw..." or "I have seen..." but NEVER "I seen..."

    Carry on.

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    I too fade consistently and really really want to start producing draws. I agree with kirksey that a high slight draw is the perfect shot in golf. One thing David Leadbetter stuck in my mind. "Good players fight draws, not fades....A fade is a very weak shot" Also on a previous thread everybody seemed to support the fact that a draw would give more distance (claiming that it would even give more distance than a straight hit)

    I have tried everything to get rid of the freaking fade
    ~changed to strong grip (club more in the fingers rather than palm on the left hand - for the right hander)
    ~closed stance
    ~closed face
    ~ball placement changed (further ahead)
    ~take the club inside during takeway and keep the same path on the downswing

    Nothing worked....for me but may be it may help you.

    Again David Leadbetter's tip was probably the thing that helped most but it still didn't get that draw working everytime. Place the ball on an uphill lie and hit practice shots. It encourages a draw for most people but only sent my balls straight. hmph!
    [FONT=Arial]Girish Dayalan[/FONT]

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhoElseButMe
    I too fade consistently and really really want to start producing draws. I agree with kirksey that a high slight draw is the perfect shot in golf. One thing David Leadbetter stuck in my mind. "Good players fight draws, not fades....A fade is a very weak shot" Also on a previous thread everybody seemed to support the fact that a draw would give more distance (claiming that it would even give more distance than a straight hit)

    I have tried everything to get rid of the freaking fade
    ~changed to strong grip (club more in the fingers rather than palm on the left hand - for the right hander)
    ~closed stance
    ~closed face
    ~ball placement changed (further ahead)
    ~take the club inside during takeway and keep the same path on the downswing

    Nothing worked....for me but may be it may help you.

    Again David Leadbetter's tip was probably the thing that helped most but it still didn't get that draw working everytime. Place the ball on an uphill lie and hit practice shots. It encourages a draw for most people but only sent my balls straight. hmph!
    That's why John Daly, Tiger Woods and several others changed from a draw to a fade. David Ledbetter should let them know.

    Look, a draw is my natural shape. I sometimes wish for a fade, because when a fade lands, it generally stays in the same timezone. When a draw gets away from you-- JUST A LITTLE-- it will roll much further. And usually exactly where you didn't want. But, again a draw is my natural shot. So I play for a draw unless I have to try and work it around an obstical. And then I may look for another shot, because it is always more clumsy to swing against your natural shape.

    Look, guys and gals. The golf swing is hard enough to learn once-- hard enough to learn WITH your natural tendencies. Don't make it harder just because David Ledbetter has a spot on TGC, or some scratch golfer says a draw is better. The perfect golf shot is the one that gets you down the fairway the safest, or on the green closest to the hole.
    Please, just call me Schemp...

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    FWIW - A year ago when Mickelson won the Master's - he confessed one of the reasons was he converted his shot shape from a draw to a fade....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo35223
    FWIW - A year ago when Mickelson won the Master's - he confessed one of the reasons was he converted his shot shape from a draw to a fade....
    Wound balls do "work" easier but you can still work the new ones. Well, at least the Pro-V's and spendy balls. The cheap ones....you can almost forget about putting a small fade or draw on them. They don't spin much.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silver
    At the risk of being a dick...remove that from your vocabulary. It makes you sound like an uneducated redneck hick from Northern Alberta.

    "I saw..." or "I have seen..." but NEVER "I seen..."

    Carry on.
    It is a message board. If it bothers you then keep it to yourself. I really don't care if people view me as an uneducated hick. The only reason I am here is to discuss golf. Also, yes, it does make you look like a dick who has nothing better to do then to correct a posters grammar.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhoElseButMe
    I too fade consistently and really really want to start producing draws. I agree with kirksey that a high slight draw is the perfect shot in golf. One thing David Leadbetter stuck in my mind. "Good players fight draws, not fades....A fade is a very weak shot" Also on a previous thread everybody seemed to support the fact that a draw would give more distance (claiming that it would even give more distance than a straight hit)

    I have tried everything to get rid of the freaking fade
    ~changed to strong grip (club more in the fingers rather than palm on the left hand - for the right hander)
    ~closed stance
    ~closed face
    ~ball placement changed (further ahead)
    ~take the club inside during takeway and keep the same path on the downswing

    Nothing worked....for me but may be it may help you.

    Again David Leadbetter's tip was probably the thing that helped most but it still didn't get that draw working everytime. Place the ball on an uphill lie and hit practice shots. It encourages a draw for most people but only sent my balls straight. hmph!

    the last two things you tried to change to produce a draw tend to produce a fade or even a slice.
    ball placement for a draw is usually back a little bit more than usual and taking the club back inside will make you bring the club back over the top and at least fade it and slice it often.
    "You ever been on a shrimp boat?"
    "No, but I've been on a real big boat."

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonMacIsaac
    It is a message board. If it bothers you then keep it to yourself. I really don't care if people view me as an uneducated hick. The only reason I am here is to discuss golf. Also, yes, it does make you look like a dick who has nothing better to do then to correct a posters grammar.
    Awesome, but it's a message board, so I don't have to keep it to myself. Good times!


    And in the spirit of the topic. I agree with everyone who says to f--- the draw and play what you already can. You might want to learn to hit one for when you need to (closed stance, strong grip, etc) - but even I, in my lowly high handicap glory, knows that you play with what you've got and if it's natural, it's probably your best bet.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silver
    Awesome, but it's a message board, so I don't have to keep it to myself. Good times!


    And in the spirit of the topic. I agree with everyone who says to f--- the draw and play what you already can. You might want to learn to hit one for when you need to (closed stance, strong grip, etc) - but even I, in my lowly high handicap glory, knows that you play with what you've got and if it's natural, it's probably your best bet.
    Then everyone who starts the game will stay with a huge pull slice....because that is the natural shot for a starter. People who don't want to improve....keep the fade/slice. If you want to get better you will have to change the swing at some point. The draw is the more powerfull ball flight, a fade will lose you a whole lot of distance in the process. The natural ball flight with a good shoulder turn and a proper release is a draw.

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    I'm sitting here laughing my butt off at you guys arguing over pulls, hooks, slices, fades, and whether boxers or briefs are better. To be honest...play with what you have. Learn how to hit everything in case there's a draw pin or a fade pin, but play with what you have. If you hit a fade, keep it. That's seriously the best iron shot you can have. It holds on the green and is killer accurate when compared to a draw. But, by all means learn to hit a draw too...you'll never know when you'll need that flight and/or extra roll. Put that flame out you two...yeah, "I seen" is totally hickish, but getting defensive is only going to egg people on. I mean really, what's more fun than sitting at home and pushing someone's buttons and watching them rage? So, accept the fact that "I seen" is hickish, everyone else leave him alone, and find something to make fun of someone else about. Just wait til whoever made fun of you makes a mistake and give a good ribbing back. I learned the hard way too....right Besson you big lovable guy!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparty3138
    I don't know why you asked this question Kirksey. In other posts you say you hit every club great. You say you want change your swing to what is more comfortable but you can't hit a draw right now, so how will it be more comfortable? Right now you hit a fade and you play well. Quit worrying about what is cool (draw) and stick with what works (fade).
    Sparty when i was playing nothing but golf, i was at the top of my game and i couldnt hit a bad iron, drive, wedge...only bad putts.
    but friggin baseball is screwing with me

    its making me do different things that i don't want to do.

    I don't want to switch to a draw and Just forget about a fade.

    But when I have to draw a ball around a bunker to get to a pin tucked tight I want to go to that shot with confidence

    the same with a fade

    I went to the Range tonight and I'm sticking with a fade for now, but will work on it later this year when baseball is through.
    I was worried about me losing my swing completely, but i felt alot better about my swing tonight. I had a really good golfer watch me and he told me not to try and work the ball, just play what you got for now and work on working your irons later.

    plus a swing change now would be for thursday

    I have a school golf tournament. My wedge game was insanely well inside 80 yards. will be relying on short game alot

    I may lose some strokes over these couple of months, but I will get my swing back.


    shooter, baseball and golf is a verrrrryyyy baddd mix.....

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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    but friggin baseball is screwing with me
    I totally feel ya man. During my years away from golf, a whole lot of tennis and recently ice hockey totally f-ed up my swing, and it took 2 months of obssessive analysis and practice (which my shoulder hates me for) to get a decent golf swing back.

    I think you should ignore everyone who says don't even try to develop the draw and just stick with what you've got. One of the great things about golf is that you constantly seek to raise your game to the next level. So you shoot some bad rounds because you've attempted some draw shots gone bad, so what? It's not like your livelihood depends on it. You're just trying to get better, and failure comes with the territory. You want to develop every tool for your arsenal so you can be the best golfer you can be. Maybe some of the best golfers in the world prefer to hit a fade more often than a draw, but they can still hit that draw when they need it. Don't accept your faults or that which you lack - fix or add them. Things like super offset drivers piss me off because they just encourage bad habits and circumvent the real problem - a bad swing.

    Anyway, my suggestion for drawing the ball would be to keep your trailing elbow tucked more against your body to get an inside-out swing path. I don't know if this is the standard method of doing it, but it certainly causes me to hit the ball right to left (I'm a righty).

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    I went to the range and i wasn't opening my hips enough.

    Once i fixed that I was hitting a slight draw, which is nice.

    Baseball just messed up my tempo, and i had to fix it again.

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    undefined
    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    But a high draw is the most perfect shot in golf....I wanna hit that shot everytime..

    Another reason I don't like the fade is because, I dont line up right for it, I have a closed stance, which means I am already aiming left and from there I end up being more left.

    I'm losing my swing slowly....baseball is starting to take effect on my swing
    undefined

    Why would you want to change what you instinctively do apprently well. Lee Trevino would disagree with your definition of the perfect golf shot. Many people play golf all their lives and never figure out what swing they have an instinct for. You on the other hand are lucky to have a consistent swing that produces consistent results. This is a strength and not a weakness like you make it sound. Closing clubfaces and such are only bandaids for a true controled draw which is really created with an inside out swing path. I recently golfed with a total stranger that was 65 years old on a championship course. He played the back tees with me and shot a legitimate 2 under 70. He did this with a three quarter swing at the most, Very flat swing plane and was KILLER around the greens. I would hardly describe this mans swing as pretty like the perfect draw you descibe but this guy gets it done. I think you can get it done also if you will only exploit the strengths you already have.

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    I don't think I really explained what I meant.

    It's not that I think a fade is a bad shot, but I want to know that I can draw the ball when I need to. And I couldn't for awhile and I worked on it hard the past couple days and I can tell my swing is coming to me again.

    and when I said a high draw was the perfect shot, I meant it as a opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bdcrowe
    That's why John Daly, Tiger Woods and several others changed from a draw to a fade. David Ledbetter should let them know.

    Look, a draw is my natural shape. I sometimes wish for a fade, because when a fade lands, it generally stays in the same timezone. When a draw gets away from you-- JUST A LITTLE-- it will roll much further. And usually exactly where you didn't want. But, again a draw is my natural shot. So I play for a draw unless I have to try and work it around an obstical. And then I may look for another shot, because it is always more clumsy to swing against your natural shape.

    Look, guys and gals. The golf swing is hard enough to learn once-- hard enough to learn WITH your natural tendencies. Don't make it harder just because David Ledbetter has a spot on TGC, or some scratch golfer says a draw is better. The perfect golf shot is the one that gets you down the fairway the safest, or on the green closest to the hole.
    Great advice schemp! Get consistent from tee to green whatever that may be and then practice the Hell out of your short game!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kirksey74
    I don't think I really explained what I meant.

    It's not that I think a fade is a bad shot, but I want to know that I can draw the ball when I need to. And I couldn't for awhile and I worked on it hard the past couple days and I can tell my swing is coming to me again.

    and when I said a high draw was the perfect shot, I meant it as a opinion.
    Of course my only intention was to encourage a fellow golfer to use his natural talent and do better. I know how frustrating golf can be if we are serious about it and truly want to improve as results can be slow and sometimes it is difficult to figure out what are bodies are really doing to produce the shot we get. Be careful and always save enough balls at the end of your practice session to go back and hit your old meat and potatos shot a few times. Sometimes when I practice new things extensively, like it sounds you are doing, I get all scewed up and need to get back to my natural swing. I like to work back thru ALL my clubs with a couple of shots each so my muscels remeber that feeling last till I hit again

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