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View Poll Results: Is drive for show putt for dough just commentator BS?

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  • Yes, driving is more important.

    10 30.30%
  • No, putting is where you make the money.

    23 69.70%
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  1. #1
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    Is driver for show and putt for dough just BS?

    I subscribe that this age old saying applies exclusively to the professional tours and not amateurs. The putter might save you a couple of shots a round if you catch fire, but a bad driver will cost you 2 shots a hole if you really spray it. For half decent golfers (guys who break 90), I believe that a good driving day will result in breaking your handicap.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

  2. #2
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    Thew driver is very important, but not as important as the putter. It is a statistical fact that you are going to use your putter more often in a round than you are going to use your driver. That automatically makes putting more important.
    Mizuno irons -- made by Hattori Hanzo, forged in the fires of Mt. Fujiyama.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Thew driver is very important, but not as important as the putter. It is a statistical fact that you are going to use your putter more often in a round than you are going to use your driver. That automatically makes putting more important.
    I get what you are saying, but my point is that a bad putt might cost you one shot, a bad drive could cost you 2 or more. Your argument would definitely be true for tour players whose bad drives only just miss the fairways, but for amatuers a bad drive could mean hitting it way into the jungle or OB, which can be more costly than a 3 putt from a good drive and GIR.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I get what you are saying, but my point is that a bad putt might cost you one shot, a bad drive could cost you 2 or more. Your argument would definitely be true for tour players whose bad drives only just miss the fairways, but for amatuers a bad drive could mean hitting it way into the jungle or OB, which can be more costly than a 3 putt from a good drive and GIR.
    I use to not be as good with my driver as I am now whenever I started serious golf. I was in the trees and hazards a LOT. But, what happened was I began to get good getting out of trouble. So, now, if I hit a wayward drive, I have the confidence and skills to make good on the next shot. That is why it is not as important to me as the putter is . . . . .
    Mizuno irons -- made by Hattori Hanzo, forged in the fires of Mt. Fujiyama.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    I use to not be as good with my driver as I am now whenever I started serious golf. I was in the trees and hazards a LOT. But, what happened was I began to get good getting out of trouble. So, now, if I hit a wayward drive, I have the confidence and skills to make good on the next shot. That is why it is not as important to me as the putter is . . . . .
    Fair call. We all have different strengths and weaknesses. I guess the driver is more important to me is because I am a pretty consistent putter, so my bad putting days usually aren't much worse than my good days. From my observations on the course, I would definitely agree that most real bad hackers could easily save themselve 10 shots a game simply by learning how to putt half decent. There are no excuses for taking 40 putts or more during a round (which I see all the time with guys off 20 or higher). Putting does not require any great level of athleticism and with a little practice any old hacker could become semi proficient with the flat stick.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Thew driver is very important, but not as important as the putter. It is a statistical fact that you are going to use your putter more often in a round than you are going to use your driver. That automatically makes putting more important.
    I agree but in a different way. I think it's a given that on average a decent player will have somewhere between 26 to 34 putts per round. However, it's a given that you'll have at least 22-25 putts so that number should be thrown out. What you are really looking at are the rest of the putts. I think putting is the most important because nothing provides more confidence than making a few 12 foot putts in a row. Good putting affects your driving and everything else. It's difficult to focus on hitting a good drive after missing a 3 foot putt.

  7. #7
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    They are both important and cannot be seperated. If you have a good driving AND putting day you can almost garantee you'll break your handicap.
    The way to score regularly in the 70's is not to have weaknesses in any part of your game. Just have a good all round game.
    You need to drive it in the fairway a reasonable distance to have the best chance at GIR's. Then you need to make a good percetage of those GIR's with good if not brilliant ironplay. etc etc. no use being a brilliant putter if you are not regularly putting for birdies or trying to save par from 40 feet. All facets of the game are important in you want to be lowish marker.
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  8. #8
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    They're both important but in different ways. The driver is more important as far as fun is concerned. But the putter is more important when it comes to scoring.

    The least fun strokes for me are 3-5 foot putts. No matter how high your percentage, they just aren't fun. True canning long putts is fun, but that's a low percentage for anyone.
    GR lives...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    They're both important but in different ways. The driver is more important as far as fun is concerned. But the putter is more important when it comes to scoring.

    The least fun strokes for me are 3-5 foot putts. No matter how high your percentage, they just aren't fun. True canning long putts is fun, but that's a low percentage for anyone.
    Join the fukin club. This length putt has troubled me since I took up the game. In fact I often rate my day in terms of how many I make or miss.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    Join the fukin club. This length putt has troubled me since I took up the game. In fact I often rate my day in terms of how many I make or miss.

    It's a strength of my game but I still hate them. Particularly the ones you have to play outside the hole.
    GR lives...

  11. #11
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    I think this really comes down to personal preference and style. As someone once said, golf is 90% mental and the other 10% is in your head. For me, this game is all about confidence. If I am not confident in my swing, my tempo is off. If my tempo is off, I can't drive, putt, or hit irons very well and my game is shite. Nothing builds my confidence better than hitting a solid drive. It sets up the entire hole and therefore the entire round. Even if I miss a 3 footer and am driving well, I head to the next tee confident that I'm going pipe one down the fairway and have a short iron into the green. The missed 3 footer is a distant memory.

  12. #12
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    I really have to rely on my short game to score well since I'm so dam short off the tee. I can "rip" one off the tee right down the middle but a real good drive for me will be 210-230 average which puts the pressure on the 2nd shots since I'm hitting a longer iron or even hybrid. Needless to say I find myself with a chip and a putt for par. = PUTT FOR DOUGH
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshuz
    I really have to rely on my short game to score well since I'm so dam short off the tee. I can "rip" one off the tee right down the middle but a real good drive for me will be 210-230 average which puts the pressure on the 2nd shots since I'm hitting a longer iron or even hybrid. Needless to say I find myself with a chip and a putt for par. = PUTT FOR DOUGH
    Well, it would really be CHIP/PUTT = DOUGH in this case, wouldn't it? If you could improve your driving just slightly and get your average drive to 250 yards, you would have a middle iron into most par 4's and could easily reach most par 5's in 3 with a wedge. I would be willing to bet that less than 10% increase in your driving distance would take several strokes off of your score. It's sort of a domino effect. If you hit a good drive that takes pressure off of your approach shot, which in turn takes pressure off of your short game, which in turn makes putting less important. However, if your driving is poor that increases the difficulty of your approach shots, results in fewer greens in regulation, and leads to poorer scoring, even if you are putting lights out.

    Like I said in my previous post, it's different for everyone. For me driving is key because a good drive sets up the entire hole for me and builds my confidence on subsequent shots. I guess I could see being a great putter taking pressure off of the rest of my game and building my confidence in my driver, irons, and short game. This would definitely result in better scoring. I just can't think of any rounds where it worked out this way. However, I can think of a bunch of rounds where I was driving the ball well and scored very well. The first time I broke 80, I shot a 77 in the morning round and a 78 in the afternoon round. I hit 3 wood off the tee all day and driving was definitely the key to both of those rounds. I don't think I made more than 3-4 putts over 10 feet in both rounds combined.

  14. #14
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    Ya when I hit a real good drive on a SHORT par four I'm lickin my chops on the second shot with a wedge and think, so this is what it's supposed to be like....
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  15. #15
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    it depends on the type of player your are, for me the putter is much more important than the driver... i would much rather be handed a driver and have to hit it in a fairway of 15yrd with OB and hazard on both sides than have a 6 foot putt... i'm just a wreck over putts of any length last tournament i played in i hit 16 girs the first round and had 12 3-putts... for me i have not problem with driver so i think that the saying is somewhat true, but for maybe a different player the drive sets up how they approach the hole so a bad drive leaves no chance mentally (and sometimes physically) for a par... so on the days when they drive it great, yeah it's BS...

  16. #16
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    WTF? Where's the wedge in this equation. I don't know how many rounds I've pulled from the crapper by getting up and down often by stuffing approaches or chipping close or the occasional chip in.

    There are 3 scoring clubs in golf - driver, wedge, and putter. If you have a weakness in any of the three you're not going to score very well. I would say it's putter, wedge, driver for me. I can play a good round of golf with a 3 iron off the tee if my wedges and putter are on fire. I can't play a good round if either of the putter or the wedge isn't working well.

    This equation gets skewed based on the style of the course. If it's tree lined with shiat everywhere than hitting a good drive is certainly necessary. If the greens are tricky and slick than having a weak flat stick will kill the round.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by poe4soul
    WTF? Where's the wedge in this equation. I don't know how many rounds I've pulled from the crapper by getting up and down often by stuffing approaches or chipping close or the occasional chip in.

    There are 3 scoring clubs in golf - driver, wedge, and putter. If you have a weakness in any of the three you're not going to score very well. I would say it's putter, wedge, driver for me. I can play a good round of golf with a 3 iron off the tee if my wedges and putter are on fire. I can't play a good round if either of the putter or the wedge isn't working well.

    This equation gets skewed based on the style of the course. If it's tree lined with shiat everywhere than hitting a good drive is certainly necessary. If the greens are tricky and slick than having a weak flat stick will kill the round.
    I agree but that's not what the poll is about, or how the ol' saying goes...
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  18. #18
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    Which is more important, the driver or the putter?
    Which is the most important leg on a 3 legged stool?
    How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
    Seldom right, never in doubt......

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorkman53
    Which is more important, the driver or the putter?
    Which is the most important leg on a 3 legged stool?
    How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
    The putter.

    All legs are equally important, unless of course the stool possesses legs of different properties.

    Depends on the size of the pin and the type of angels.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mizuno>Ping
    The putter.

    All legs are equally important, unless of course the stool possesses legs of different properties.

    Depends on the size of the pin and the type of angels.
    Thanks for providing definitive and authoritative answers to these perplexing questions.

    I, for one, will sleep better tonight with this knowledge.
    Seldom right, never in doubt......

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorkman53
    Which is more important, the driver or the putter?
    Which is the most important leg on a 3 legged stool?How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
    The middle leg is the most important, of course. The other questions don't matter nearly as much.
    GR lives...

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    The middle leg is the most important, of course. The other questions don't matter nearly as much.
    If you turn it upside down at a gay bar, they're all equally important....
    team obnoxious
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  23. #23
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    In reading back a few posts, I gotta say I'm proud and amazed how quickly and thoroughly we can run a perfectly legit golf thread right in to the gutter!
    It brings a tear to my eye just to be a part of it.....
    team obnoxious
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  24. #24
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    LOL...yeah, I'm impressed!

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    Quote Originally Posted by indacup
    LOL...yeah, I'm impressed!
    HA! And you thought this was a golf forum!........
    team obnoxious
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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by poe4soul
    WTF? Where's the wedge in this equation. I don't know how many rounds I've pulled from the crapper by getting up and down often by stuffing approaches or chipping close or the occasional chip in.

    There are 3 scoring clubs in golf - driver, wedge, and putter. If you have a weakness in any of the three you're not going to score very well. I would say it's putter, wedge, driver for me. I can play a good round of golf with a 3 iron off the tee if my wedges and putter are on fire. I can't play a good round if either of the putter or the wedge isn't working well.

    This equation gets skewed based on the style of the course. If it's tree lined with shiat everywhere than hitting a good drive is certainly necessary. If the greens are tricky and slick than having a weak flat stick will kill the round.
    As Noshuz pointed out, this thread was referring to the old saying about drive for show blah blah, but you raise a valid point about other parts of the game being important.

    On reflection of the good rounds I've played over the years on tough courses, the thing that sticks out in my mind is how many times I got up and down from around the green with a good chip. I also had to make my share of knee kockers to get the par, but it was probably the ability to consistently chip to one putt range that made the difference. On reflection I can also say that most of the shots I waste around the course are not bad drives or missed short putts. By far and away I throw more shots away with duffed chips than anything else. I think this is the biggest weakness i my game, and if I became a consistently good chipper I think I could take at least the obligatory 4 shots off my cap.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshuz
    In reading back a few posts, I gotta say I'm proud and amazed how quickly and thoroughly we can run a perfectly legit golf thread right in to the gutter!
    It brings a tear to my eye just to be a part of it.....
    And did you notice also it was Dorkman, the old stager who did the derailing?
    I think it was Indacup who mentioned boredom in his posting yesterday. I think this is Dorkmans issue. How many times in his long tenure at GR has the subject been raised "is putting or driving more important?".
    Watch out for his responses if the further questions posed are "is forged better than cast?" or "are blades better than cavities?"
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    It's a strength of my game but I still hate them. Particularly the ones you have to play outside the hole.
    I've made more 3-5 footers in the past five years than in the other thirty I have been playing.

    It's all in the putter, I swear. I bought a crap putter on Ebay and it's been the best thing ever in my life that wasn't sex.

    and I've even considered it for that.

    I actually have lots of confidence in my stroke for those putts today... still suck at reading greens, but yanking or shoving putts is a thing of the past.

    wierd.
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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins
    I've made more 3-5 footers in the past five years than in the other thirty I have been playing.

    It's all in the putter, I swear. I bought a crap putter on Ebay and it's been the best thing ever in my life that wasn't sex.

    and I've even considered it for that.

    I actually have lots of confidence in my stroke for those putts today... still suck at reading greens, but yanking or shoving putts is a thing of the past.

    wierd.
    Yeah Dave I have had a similar experience. Bought a Teardrop TD17 putter on a gut feeling for $50 on the bay and it is by far the best putter I have used to date. It must be the weight or the head design or both, but with my normal stroke without manipulation it just seems to go where I'm aiming. (My chronic miss is a pulled 4 footer). I think the roll face really works too. The ball just rolls really pure off the face. I play on pure, smooth greens and my mates have commented on how good the roll of the ball is. They think I have changed my stroke but it is all the putter. It just proves that you need to keep looking for a putter that suits you best. Most of it may be the indian, but the right arrow really helps.
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveperkins
    I've made more 3-5 footers in the past five years than in the other thirty I have been playing.

    It's all in the putter, I swear. I bought a crap putter on Ebay and it's been the best thing ever in my life that wasn't sex.

    and I've even considered it for that.

    I actually have lots of confidence in my stroke for those putts today... still suck at reading greens, but yanking or shoving putts is a thing of the past.

    wierd.
    Sometimes you need to fart around with some different types of putters in order to find the right one for you. I did the same over the last 5 years and found the length and style I needed. Then, I found a brand new Bettinardi with that length and style. I'm satisfied.
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Sometimes you need to fart around with some different types of putters in order to find the right one for you. I did the same over the last 5 years and found the length and style I needed. Then, I found a brand new Bettinardi with that length and style. I'm satisfied.
    I'm convinced alot of guys have an ideal head weight and toe/heel balance. For most of us, it's just trial and error. I've heard Dave P's story a few times before.

    If those characteristics don't matter, then any old Nike putter will do.
    GR lives...

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Sometimes you need to fart around with some different types of putters in order to find the right one for you. I did the same over the last 5 years and found the length and style I needed. Then, I found a brand new Bettinardi with that length and style. I'm satisfied.
    Agree with this entirely. I figured out that with my putting style (left hand low, SBST) I needed a face balanced mallet style putter to get best results. I also needed a shorter shaft as SBST tends to have the hands hanging straight down. So when I found my current putter, I jumped at it. I got it shortened and had a new grip, and it's now my all time favourite putter. I must admot though that I was still loking for a quality putter, and don't know if I could ever be happy with a Walmart special, there would always just be a little voice in my head telling me that it was crap. I admire Dave's lack of snobbery in his choice of putter.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    I'm convinced alot of guys have an ideal head weight and toe/heel balance. For most of us, it's just trial and error. I've heard Dave P's story a few times before.
    That's exactly what I was trying to say. I believe I have found mine.
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    Agree with this entirely. I figured out that with my putting style (left hand low, SBST) I needed a face balanced mallet style putter to get best results. I also needed a shorter shaft as SBST tends to have the hands hanging straight down. So when I found my current putter, I jumped at it. I got it shortened and had a new grip, and it's now my all time favourite putter. I must admot though that I was still loking for a quality putter, and don't know if I could ever be happy with a Walmart special, there would always just be a little voice in my head telling me that it was crap. I admire Dave's lack of snobbery in his choice of putter.
    Dave is from Texas, there is no reason for him to be snobbish about anything.
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Dave is from Texas, there is no reason for him to be snobbish about anything.
    Damn right. No good qualities, ergo no pretense. :-) It's all so liberating... and besides, we shoot snobs down here, and the judge finds us not guilty almost every time..

    But it truly is a crap putter, and it wasn't even MADE in Texas.

    It's a short shaft, a sort of 2-ball knockoff with only one ball (apologies to Lance Armstrong AND John Kruk) but that rearward reach of the Odyssey 2 ball style (or is it a three ball? Texan math skills kicking in).. and the grip is huge, double the width of normal grips so I can put both thumbs side by side on the flat top... the length of the shaft and the width of the grip just flat out fit me, and the way it sits on the ground almost guarantees a straight-back, straight-thru movement with quiet hands and just shoulders moving.. I feel like I can't miss a four footer, and if I'd have had that feeling when I was 20 yrs old I'd have been a golf pro... $50 on Ebay, including shipping, and I've put lead tape and permanent marker all over the head so it looks 'custom' but those things don't really do anything.
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  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I get what you are saying, but my point is that a bad putt might cost you one shot, a bad drive could cost you 2 or more. Your argument would definitely be true for tour players whose bad drives only just miss the fairways, but for amatuers a bad drive could mean hitting it way into the jungle or OB, which can be more costly than a 3 putt from a good drive and GIR.
    I would agree up to a point but in the course of a round the chances are that you will three putt more often than you will send a ball into the boondocks or OB. From personal experience my high scores are caused by short game defficiencies rather than poor driving. I may be lucky but I can go 5 or 6 rounds without hitting a ball OB or into the jungle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I subscribe that this age old saying applies exclusively to the professional tours and not amateurs. The putter might save you a couple of shots a round if you catch fire, but a bad driver will cost you 2 shots a hole if you really spray it. For half decent golfers (guys who break 90), I believe that a good driving day will result in breaking your handicap.
    NAH
    If your driver is letting you down 2 7 irons and a wedge will get you there with par or a bogey. This takes the OB driver out of the hole. Most par 4's today don't require a driver anyway, and most golfers if they do bust the driver f uck up there wedge into the hole, fifty yards in and any shot inside of fifty yards is more important than a busted drive anytime.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I subscribe that this age old saying applies exclusively to the professional tours and not amateurs. The putter might save you a couple of shots a round if you catch fire, but a bad driver will cost you 2 shots a hole if you really spray it. For half decent golfers (guys who break 90), I believe that a good driving day will result in breaking your handicap.
    When you dont carry a handicap the driver is the least of your worries. The putter will make or break your round if you cant make those 6 footers for par.
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    Most tour pros can have 80% GIR... then that where the putting contest will start... End of story

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    Great driving sets you up for a much nicer approach shots, and has great intimidation factor on opponents. Making clutch puts separates winners from losers.
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    Well, this should end the argument....I drove the ball today better than I ever have in my life, hit 7 out of 9 fairways (I can only play 9 at a time, too busy with other sh it). The two fairways I didn't hit I had a clear shot to the green in the intermediate cut. Average distance was about 260-270. The guy I was playing with was f ucking tripping on my driving as was I since I usually have kind of a hard time off the tee. Anyway, long story short I shot by a f ucking mile the worst 9 hole score I've had in years....chipping=terrible, putting=absolutely horrible, driver=best I've ever hit it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 12sandwich
    Great driving sets you up for a much nicer approach shots, and has great intimidation factor on opponents. Making clutch puts separates winners from losers.

    Yes, and great irons intimidate opponents. And, if you chip it close it separates you. Did you know that it gets hotter in the summer than in the winter?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mentaloaf
    Well, this should end the argument....I drove the ball today better than I ever have in my life, hit 7 out of 9 fairways (I can only play 9 at a time, too busy with other sh it). The two fairways I didn't hit I had a clear shot to the green in the intermediate cut. Average distance was about 260-270. The guy I was playing with was f ucking tripping on my driving as was I since I usually have kind of a hard time off the tee. Anyway, long story short I shot by a f ucking mile the worst 9 hole score I've had in years....chipping=terrible, putting=absolutely horrible, driver=best I've ever hit it.
    WTF? No par 3's or do you drive on par 3's? Short knocker? Or do you golf? Maybe miniature golf?

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    Quote Originally Posted by poe4soul
    WTF? No par 3's or do you drive on par 3's? Short knocker? Or do you golf? Maybe miniature golf?
    Maybe he was so frustrated with his driving that he decided to bomb it over the par 3's with his driver. "no, no, the green's over there Mr. Havacamp".

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    Quote Originally Posted by mentaloaf
    Well, this should end the argument....I drove the ball today better than I ever have in my life, hit 7 out of 9 fairways (I can only play 9 at a time, too busy with other sh it). The two fairways I didn't hit I had a clear shot to the green in the intermediate cut. Average distance was about 260-270. The guy I was playing with was f ucking tripping on my driving as was I since I usually have kind of a hard time off the tee. Anyway, long story short I shot by a f ucking mile the worst 9 hole score I've had in years....chipping=terrible, putting=absolutely horrible, driver=best I've ever hit it.
    Hence his name (Mental) (Loaf).
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    GIR on the par 3's

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    One of the par 3's is 230 and when it's blasting tradewinds I hit my driver on that one

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    When you play from real tees with real distances... it's hard to say that driving is not just as important. It is true on several courses, you can leave a driver out of your bag. However, that is because most courses are so old that technology way out-distances the tees. Of course putting is more important when you don't have to improve your driving distance to score. Furthermore, any hack has at least the physical chance of a 10-foot putt... this is not true of a 270+ drive. That takes real swing mechanics and years of practice. As far as the mental side, why does a tour pro drive perfectly on the range and then snap or slice all over a tournament? Mental... right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    When you play from real tees with real distances... it's hard to say that driving is not just as important. It is true on several courses, you can leave a driver out of your bag. However, that is because most courses are so old that technology way out-distances the tees. Of course putting is more important when you don't have to improve your driving distance to score. Furthermore, any hack has at least the physical chance of a 10-foot putt... this is not true of a 270+ drive. That takes real swing mechanics and years of practice. As far as the mental side, why does a tour pro drive perfectly on the range and then snap or slice all over a tournament? Mental... right?
    You raise some good points. I've played some really long, tight courses from the tips where you need driver on most of the par 4s, and where a drive even 2 metres off the fairway (and in Oz we usually have hard fairways on good courses so they will run into trouble) means chipping out sideways and a dropped shot at best. This adds up on your scorecard and erodes your confidence for the rest of your game. I have also played linksy courses in still conditions, where you can drive it off the planet and still have a clear shot to the green, but the greens are like billiard tables covered in ice with buried elephants in them and you have 40 putts for the round. Maybe it does depend on the course you are playing to some extent.
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    The Bottom line is really Putting. A good day putting beats a bad day driving. Nothing boosts your confidence like 1 putting a green or a par save from the bunker. Just because a course is long doesnt mean you have to use driver. It just means you need to become a better long iron fairwaywood player, or find your short game in the bottom of the Frosted Flakes box in the Morning. I think it boils right down to Ball Contact all the way thru the bag down to the putter. The more pure the strike, the better the results and the better the feeling thru your nerves to the mind.

    And then course management . You have to manage the course.
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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    Yes, and great irons intimidate opponents. And, if you chip it close it separates you. Did you know that it gets hotter in the summer than in the winter?
    Driving for show versus putting for dough$ iron head. Whats the hottest month for you aussies being its summer there?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 12sandwich
    Driving for show versus putting for dough$ iron head. Whats the hottest month for you aussies being its summer there?
    It varies from year to year. We usually have hot weeks more than months. This year we had a record heat wave in November, which is technically still Spring, and have had a pretty mild December and start to January. Statistically January would probably be the hottest, being the middle of Summer.
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    Another factor in putting versus driving is the size, shape and speed of greens. I touched on this in my last post, but didn't take into account green size. Obviuosly if you are playing a course with huge greens putting is everything as you will hit alot of GIR but have some lengthy putts. On courses with small greens driving has added inportance as you need to be in good position from the tee to have a chance of hitting greens. Obviously on this type of course chipping is the most important part of the game, but the thread isn't about chipping.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    And did you notice also it was Dorkman, the old stager who did the derailing?
    I think it was Indacup who mentioned boredom in his posting yesterday. I think this is Dorkmans issue. How many times in his long tenure at GR has the subject been raised "is putting or driving more important?".
    Watch out for his responses if the further questions posed are "is forged better than cast?" or "are blades better than cavities?"

    So Dorkman didn't stay dead?

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    Quote Originally Posted by GolfEpisode
    The Bottom line is really Putting. A good day putting beats a bad day driving. Nothing boosts your confidence like 1 putting a green or a par save from the bunker. Just because a course is long doesnt mean you have to use driver. It just means you need to become a better long iron fairwaywood player, or find your short game in the bottom of the Frosted Flakes box in the Morning. I think it boils right down to Ball Contact all the way thru the bag down to the putter. The more pure the strike, the better the results and the better the feeling thru your nerves to the mind.

    And then course management . You have to manage the course.
    Quit copying my posts you mutant.

  56. #56
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    The 2 most prolific golfers in the past 100 years (Hogan and Larryrsf) believe that putting is for retards. That should answer this question fully.
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    I get your point with LaHarry, but how was Hogan prolific?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horseballs
    The 2 most prolific golfers in the past 100 years (Hogan and Larryrsf) believe that putting is for retards. That should answer this question fully.
    As Larry speaks on behalf of 99% of good golfers, it's hard to argue with this.
    The views expressed by Not a Hacker are not meant to be understood by you primitive screw heads. Don't take it personally, just sit back and enjoy the writings of your better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerBS
    Thew driver is very important, but not as important as the putter. It is a statistical fact that you are going to use your putter more often in a round than you are going to use your driver. That automatically makes putting more important.
    Flawed logic here. The OP stated that if the driver isn't working it will be responsible for 2-3 strokes per hole (1 extra in a hazard 2 extra OB). This is two strokes more than it should account for if you were hitting it correctly. No matter how bad you are with your putter, you rarely cost yourself two strokes per hole. The OP also stated that this applies mainly to amateurs. For them they may hit multiple balls OB costing them even more in strokes.

    Last time I checked even amateurs rarely if ever 5 putt. Even less rare is five putting multiple times in a round. The other thing being confused is the term"Drive for Show". I think this refers to the tee shot and is unrelated to the use of the driver. Regardless of the club being used for the tee shot, hitting balls into a hazard or OB will cost more strokes than a bad putting day.

    An added note: none of this applies to people that can't hit the ball long enough to make it to a hazard or OB!

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    Goof stuff. I'm all for course management but how does a player with a 220-yard drive course manage a 420-yard uphill par 4? Go to the 3-wood and leave a 220-230 approach shot? I guess you better be a amazing putter with those kind of second shots. In my experience, the game improved drastically when I started to get some length off the tee. I think we have been over this before. If you're going to a 3-hybrid all the time on a par 4 second shot, you are playing from the wrong tees or need some swing coaching. The game is a lot better when your par 4 second shot is the 7-9 iron it was supposed to be.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    Goof stuff. I'm all for course management but how does a player with a 220-yard drive course manage a 420-yard uphill par 4? Go to the 3-wood and leave a 220-230 approach shot? I guess you better be a amazing putter with those kind of second shots. In my experience, the game improved drastically when I started to get some length off the tee. I think we have been over this before. If you're going to a 3-hybrid all the time on a par 4 second shot, you are playing from the wrong tees or need some swing coaching. The game is a lot better when your par 4 second shot is the 7-9 iron it was supposed to be.
    I agree. Being a short knocker I'm faced with a hybrid second shot alot and that doesn't equate to GIR as much as is would with a 7-P second shot. That usually means a chip and a one putt for par making my putting much more important than driving...
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshuz
    I agree. Being a short knocker I'm faced with a hybrid second shot alot and that doesn't equate to GIR as much as is would with a 7-P second shot. That usually means a chip and a one putt for par making my putting much more important than driving...
    You've just explained the importance of good driving and then mistakenly said that putting is more important. You're not supposed to one putt every green. You're not going to one putt every green. Nobody does! That is why driving is so important. By your logic you don't hit it long enough to hit a green in regulation. This puts more pressure on your whole game. You could just as easily say that chipping/pitching is most important in your scenario. In truth poor driving ability has made your entire game much more difficult than it needs to be. Even if you sunk every putt, you would never break par with driving like that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SDB1
    You've just explained the importance of good driving and then mistakenly said that putting is more important.
    I was thinking the same thing. Noshuz, please update your vote accordingly...

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    Quote Originally Posted by SDB1
    You've just explained the importance of good driving and then mistakenly said that putting is more important. You're not supposed to one putt every green. You're not going to one putt every green. Nobody does! That is why driving is so important. By your logic you don't hit it long enough to hit a green in regulation. This puts more pressure on your whole game. You could just as easily say that chipping/pitching is most important in your scenario. In truth poor driving ability has made your entire game much more difficult than it needs to be. Even if you sunk every putt, you would never break par with driving like that.
    Let me re-splain. First, is this a poll of what's important to us individually or is it in general. I was giving my opinion of whats important to my situation and the things I have control of. My diving distance is something that's not going to change. It's never going to be anything better than 210-230 on average. The things I do have more control over are my second shots or putting. The long second shots are in all actuality are the most important to MY game but that's not what the poll is about. Lets face it. It's all about GIR isn't it? If we all had the luxury of 2 putting for par it would be easy to say driving is more important.
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    I think a lot of people are confusing putting with "short game". If it were driving vs. short game, short game wins hands down. Something like 60% of your shots are within 100 yards. If you have a killer short game, but suck at driving, you could tee off with a 5 iron all day and break 80. However, the poll is putting vs. driving. Miss a drive and it can easily cost you 2 shots. I can only think of one time in my entire life where a bad putt cost me 2 shots. I can think of many, many drives that cost me 2 shots.

    Being a great putter can save maybe 3-4 strokes per round. Being a sh!tty driver can easily cost you 10 strokes per round.

    I don't really think this is personal preference, but rather common sense. If you are driving the ball well your confidence is high right from the start. This takes pressure off of your iron play, which in turn leads to more GIR. More GIR leads to better scoring even if your putting is weak.

    If you are putting lights out, but can't get off the tee, you are still not going to score well. You may save a lot of pars/bogeys, but are not going to have any shots at birdie if you aren't hitting fairways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KoolCat
    I think a lot of people are confusing putting with "short game". If it were driving vs. short game, short game wins hands down. Something like 60% of your shots are within 100 yards. If you have a killer short game, but suck at driving, you could tee off with a 5 iron all day and break 80. However, the poll is putting vs. driving. Miss a drive and it can easily cost you 2 shots. I can only think of one time in my entire life where a bad putt cost me 2 shots. I can think of many, many drives that cost me 2 shots.

    Being a great putter can save maybe 3-4 strokes per round. Being a sh!tty driver can easily cost you 10 strokes per round.

    I don't really think this is personal preference, but rather common sense. If you are driving the ball well your confidence is high right from the start. This takes pressure off of your iron play, which in turn leads to more GIR. More GIR leads to better scoring even if your putting is weak.

    If you are putting lights out, but can't get off the tee, you are still not going to score well. You may save a lot of pars/bogeys, but are not going to have any shots at birdie if you aren't hitting fairways.
    Define "sh!tty driving". Are you talking about OB or in the trees? I wouldn't say my driving is sh!tty, it's just short. I'm in the fairway more often than not, I'm just not within short club range. Thanks god I have worked so much on my short game because without it I would be a 20+ hc. Now if I could tighten up my long second shots so I was 2 putting for par I would be money. THAT is something I do have control over.
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    To me, short drives are not necessarily sh!tty drives. I've played with geezers who can't hit it over 200 yards, but hit it straight and can break 80 easily. Sh!tty drives are drives that cost you strokes because you are in bunkers, OB, punching out of the trees, etc.

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    This depends a lot of the gofler's own habits and the course conditiosn in which they play. You also have to look at extremely bad putting vs. driving and mediocre driving vs putting separately. These are generalizations, but I think horrible driving will hurt you more than horrible putting as you will often incur penalty strokes for lost balls/OB/water, or being stuck behind trees. But I also think marginal putting will cost you more than marginal driving as it is likely that you will 3 and 4 putt with a careless stroke. As long as you can keep your driver out of hazards or not be blocked by trees on the second shot, you wont hit massive scores. I do think both elements are the two most important elements of low golf socres, followed closely by having a solid greenside short game. In short, a bad golfer or a new golfer needs to learn how to hit the driver and irons well in order to be able to putt in the first place, but any seasoned golfer after that will understand the valule of one and two putting every hole. Both influence the iron play and short game since one is the cause of the iron play position and one is the result of the iron play.

    The several times in my life that I broke par, I was mostly accurate off the tee with the driver (so I also got maximum distance for my game at the time instead of laying back with a 5 wood or long iron) but I also had a lot of one putts or avoided three putts. Since I was on fire with the long ball, I came into greens with shorter and easier to place irons, but since I was one putting a lot within the 15 to 30 foot range, I did not need to be as accurate with the iron play either. Putting has a greater effect on my scores moreso than driving. I am usually able to recover from a bad driving hole or two and get my ball back into the fairway off the tee, but I usually cannot recover from a bad day on the greens.
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    Quote Originally Posted by connecticutter
    This depends a lot of the gofler's own habits and the course conditiosn in which they play. You also have to look at extremely bad putting vs. driving and mediocre driving vs putting separately. These are generalizations, but I think horrible driving will hurt you more than horrible putting as you will often incur penalty strokes for lost balls/OB/water, or being stuck behind trees. But I also think marginal putting will cost you more than marginal driving as it is likely that you will 3 and 4 putt with a careless stroke. As long as you can keep your driver out of hazards or not be blocked by trees on the second shot, you wont hit massive scores. I do think both elements are the two most important elements of low golf socres, followed closely by having a solid greenside short game. In short, a bad golfer or a new golfer needs to learn how to hit the driver and irons well in order to be able to putt in the first place, but any seasoned golfer after that will understand the valule of one and two putting every hole. Both influence the iron play and short game since one is the cause of the iron play position and one is the result of the iron play.

    The several times in my life that I broke par, I was mostly accurate off the tee with the driver (so I also got maximum distance for my game at the time instead of laying back with a 5 wood or long iron) but I also had a lot of one putts or avoided three putts. Since I was on fire with the long ball, I came into greens with shorter and easier to place irons, but since I was one putting a lot within the 15 to 30 foot range, I did not need to be as accurate with the iron play either.
    I think this post should end this thread. Words spoken so true from a real golfer. No hacker could ever understand the meaning of this statement. Well done Cutter
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    Quote Originally Posted by GolfEpisode
    I think this post should end this thread. Words spoken so true from a real golfer. No hacker could ever understand the meaning of this statement. Well done Cutter
    I agree. He makes some good points. And I believe I've only putted OB once or twice....
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoolCat
    To me, short drives are not necessarily sh!tty drives. I've played with geezers who can't hit it over 200 yards, but hit it straight and can break 80 easily. Sh!tty drives are drives that cost you strokes because you are in bunkers, OB, punching out of the trees, etc.
    I've lost count of the number of old blokes I've seen over the years who are magical putters with great short games, but couldn't break 90 in a fit because of their short driving. If I had the short game of some of the old fart 20 caps I've played with I'd be a low single figure. The only old blokes I've ever seen who break 80 are the ones who can still hit the ball long (240 plus yards).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I've lost count of the number of old blokes I've seen over the years who are magical putters with great short games, but couldn't break 90 in a fit because of their short driving. If I had the short game of some of the old fart 20 caps I've played with I'd be a low single figure. The only old blokes I've ever seen who break 80 are the ones who can still hit the ball long (240 plus yards).
    My point exactly. If you can't drive the ball long and stright you rarely have an opportunity to make a putt for par, let alone birdie. A long straight drive up the middle takes all the pressure off the rest of your game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SDB1
    My point exactly. If you can't drive the ball long and stright you rarely have an opportunity to make a putt for par, let alone birdie. A long straight drive up the middle takes all the pressure off the rest of your game.
    And if you are playing championship courses from the tips, there are some holes that you simply can't get to the fairway if you can't hit it over 200 yards. And even at the pro level, for all the examples of guys like Bubba who hit it miles but don't win much, there are also examples of great putters who don't win much either. Baddeley has been the number ranked putter on tour for years but isn't in the top 50 in world rankings. Corey Pavin has had one of the best short games in the business for years but his lack of length stops him winning much. If you look at the top 10 players in the world over an extended period, all of them will be long, straight hitters and good putters.
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    All said and done putting is the only part of the game that can take you more strokes to get in the hole than it did to get there in the first place. But if your not a Player then driving is more important than putting because you have too first put the ball in play. A Player can hit bad drives and recover better due to shot repertoire, state of mind and above average putting knowledge and short game skills.

    Just thought id clear up what your post meant Cutt. You should learn too spell check lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by SDB1
    My point exactly. If you can't drive the ball long and stright you rarely have an opportunity to make a putt for par, let alone birdie. A long straight drive up the middle takes all the pressure off the rest of your game.
    Also impresses the fuk out of your playing partners, so you've that going for you. Which is nice.
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    Since this poll is about what is more important to US, I would easily say putting is paramont to a good game.

    My drives are not known to be typically long or short...but average in distance but almost always safely in bounds.

    Bear in mind that we play basic armature courses, whereas many of the PGA players will play extended courses, where the driving distance is more critical.

    IMO the majority of people put too much emphasis on driver distance...I cannot believe how much our kids in the high school and to some extent here, college level on driver distance and all but ignore the critical components to good play.

    Back around 2003, we tried an experiment with the high school boys team.

    We had them play a round of golf (competing against fellow team members) using only a putter, a wedge, 7-iron and their choice of any single club they wanted. With the incentive being wherever they placed that day, would be where they would be ranked against our opponents in next weeks tournament.

    Out of the 12 players, 5 selected drivers, a couple used fairway woods, a couple hybrids and the rest 5-irons.

    Our course is NOT a short course by any means...par 72 with one par 5 coming in at 590 yards.

    Anyway, when the dust settled, we had seven of the 12 shoot LOWER than their previous course average....all but one of them had used a 5 iron or Hybrid as their fourth club, except one who used a 5 wood.

    I came up with this idea after a talk with our club pro who said he used it a few years earlier to emphasis to a couple of his better players, the importance of accuracy and course management.....the pro was Larry Gladsen, and one of the players he was trying to get this point across to, was a young fellow club member, Zach Johnson..

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    Quote Originally Posted by indacup
    Since this poll is about what is more important to US, I would easily say putting is paramont to a good game.

    My drives are not known to be typically long or short...but average in distance but almost always safely in bounds.

    Bear in mind that we play basic armature courses, whereas many of the PGA players will play extended courses, where the driving distance is more critical.

    IMO the majority of people put too much emphasis on driver distance...I cannot believe how much our kids in the high school and to some extent here, college level on driver distance and all but ignore the critical components to good play.

    Back around 2003, we tried an experiment with the high school boys team.

    We had them play a round of golf (competing against fellow team members) using only a putter, a wedge, 7-iron and their choice of any single club they wanted. With the incentive being wherever they placed that day, would be where they would be ranked against our opponents in next weeks tournament.

    Out of the 12 players, 5 selected drivers, a couple used fairway woods, a couple hybrids and the rest 5-irons.

    Our course is NOT a short course by any means...par 72 with one par 5 coming in at 590 yards.

    Anyway, when the dust settled, we had seven of the 12 shoot LOWER than their previous course average....all but one of them had used a 5 iron or Hybrid as their fourth club, except one who used a 5 wood.

    I came up with this idea after a talk with our club pro who said he used it a few years earlier to emphasis to a couple of his better players, the importance of accuracy and course management.....the pro was Larry Gladsen, and one of the players he was trying to get this point across to, was a young fellow club member, Zach Johnson..
    Nice! I was hoping you were going to chime in on this indacup. Course management is something that I think alot of hackers don't even think of. All they want to do is stand up to the ball a whack the sh!t out of it, totally not taking into account their next shot. My GPS really opened my eyes to course manangement with the layup yardages which gives the game a whole new dimension. It becomes a chess game especially when your trying to play to your strengths.
    example: The par 5 at my goat track used to play as follows:
    1-Driver 2-17*hybrid(from 250-275) 3-wedge (20-50 pitch) 4/5- PUTT
    Now it's
    1-Driver 2-7 or 8 iron(250-275) 3-wedge (100-110) 4/5-PUTT
    I love this hole now and how it plays. Anytime I have a wedge in my hands at 100 or so yards I'm lickin' my chops. I would much rather have that shot than a much more difficult pitch from 20-50 yards.
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    Now we are confusing people who try to pound the piss out of the ball with people that actually have the proper mechanics and training. The original point of the thread was putting versus driving... not short game... not course management. I'm sorry but a PLAYER is also someone who can generate distance without pounding the piss out of the ball. Bad drives (as well as short drives) cost more strokes that bad putts. What cost Ricky Barnes an 8-shot lead at this years US Open? Bad driving... he got nervous and hit some glorious ducks off the tee. Driving is just as mental and requires just as much finesse as putting. And, if someone is having a mental issue they are still going to snap or slice a 3-wood, 5-wood or any other course managed shot.

    And by the way, Zach Johnson is the most boring and uninspiring major champion in long line of future borg-implanted and indoctrinated boring US champions (including the like of Ricky Barnes and Lucas Glover).
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    And by the way, Zach Johnson is the most boring and uninspiring major champion in long line of future borg-implanted and indoctrinated boring US champions (including the like of Ricky Barnes and Lucas Glover).
    I don't believe many sponsors select their representatives based on their on course entertainment value...LOL

    He's a very calm, peaceful and unpretentious person...I ran into him over the holidays...(he was buying golf lessons with Larry as a Christmas gift for his dad)...and despite being a multi-millionaire, he was still driving his 2003 Burgundy Ford Explorer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by indacup
    I don't believe many sponsors select their representatives based on their on course entertainment value...LOL

    He's a very calm, peaceful and unpretentious person...I ran into him over the holidays...(he was buying golf lessons with Larry as a Christmas gift for his dad)...and despite being a multi-millionaire, he was still driving his 2003 Burgundy Ford Explorer.
    If they did they would all want to sponsor JD!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by indacup
    Back around 2003, we tried an experiment with the high school boys team.

    I'm sure nothing you did hadn't already been done by countless Catholic priests.
    GR lives...

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    Quote Originally Posted by indacup
    Since this poll is about what is more important to US, I would easily say putting is paramont to a good game.

    My drives are not known to be typically long or short...but average in distance but almost always safely in bounds.

    Bear in mind that we play basic armature courses, whereas many of the PGA players will play extended courses, where the driving distance is more critical.

    IMO the majority of people put too much emphasis on driver distance...I cannot believe how much our kids in the high school and to some extent here, college level on driver distance and all but ignore the critical components to good play.

    Back around 2003, we tried an experiment with the high school boys team.

    We had them play a round of golf (competing against fellow team members) using only a putter, a wedge, 7-iron and their choice of any single club they wanted. With the incentive being wherever they placed that day, would be where they would be ranked against our opponents in next weeks tournament.

    Out of the 12 players, 5 selected drivers, a couple used fairway woods, a couple hybrids and the rest 5-irons.

    Our course is NOT a short course by any means...par 72 with one par 5 coming in at 590 yards.

    Anyway, when the dust settled, we had seven of the 12 shoot LOWER than their previous course average....all but one of them had used a 5 iron or Hybrid as their fourth club, except one who used a 5 wood.

    I came up with this idea after a talk with our club pro who said he used it a few years earlier to emphasis to a couple of his better players, the importance of accuracy and course management.....the pro was Larry Gladsen, and one of the players he was trying to get this point across to, was a young fellow club member, Zach Johnson..
    Another example of why driving reigns supreme. One can assume that in your example players were putting more shots in the fairway and not taking penalty strokes. This directly led to lower average scores. It's probably a safe bet to say these players didn't ALL putt better than average, correct?

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    I think the importance of putting is overrated.....
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    And by the way, Zach Johnson is the most boring and uninspiring major champion in long line of future borg-implanted and indoctrinated boring US champions (including the like of Ricky Barnes and Lucas Glover).
    mmmm I think if I was a major corporate sponsor who had invested zillions of $$$ over the years in a particular player, I'd probably rather that player be boring right about now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    Now we are confusing people who try to pound the piss out of the ball with people that actually have the proper mechanics and training. The original point of the thread was putting versus driving... not short game... not course management. I'm sorry but a PLAYER is also someone who can generate distance without pounding the piss out of the ball. Bad drives (as well as short drives) cost more strokes that bad putts. What cost Ricky Barnes an 8-shot lead at this years US Open? Bad driving... he got nervous and hit some glorious ducks off the tee. Driving is just as mental and requires just as much finesse as putting. And, if someone is having a mental issue they are still going to snap or slice a 3-wood, 5-wood or any other course managed shot.

    And by the way, Zach Johnson is the most boring and uninspiring major champion in long line of future borg-implanted and indoctrinated boring US champions (including the like of Ricky Barnes and Lucas Glover).
    Couldn't agree more with your appraisal of Zach Johnson, but I'll have to disagree with Barnes. He came to Oz a few years ago and was anything but boring. He had a couple of club throwing dummy spits that would put Tiger's antics in the shade (actualy bordered on mental breakdown) and demolished a nearby tree after an errant shot. And word around the traps was he was very popular and with the ladies during his trip. Read this article and tell me Ricky Barnes is boring. The only bad thing is, I actually put some money on him to win that event.

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/Golf/Badt...787019347.html
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    Quote Originally Posted by noshuz
    Nice! I was hoping you were going to chime in on this indacup. Course management is something that I think alot of hackers don't even think of. All they want to do is stand up to the ball a whack the sh!t out of it, totally not taking into account their next shot. My GPS really opened my eyes to course manangement with the layup yardages which gives the game a whole new dimension. It becomes a chess game especially when your trying to play to your strengths.
    example: The par 5 at my goat track used to play as follows:
    1-Driver 2-17*hybrid(from 250-275) 3-wedge (20-50 pitch) 4/5- PUTT
    Now it's
    1-Driver 2-7 or 8 iron(250-275) 3-wedge (100-110) 4/5-PUTT
    I love this hole now and how it plays. Anytime I have a wedge in my hands at 100 or so yards I'm lickin' my chops. I would much rather have that shot than a much more difficult pitch from 20-50 yards.
    Are you and indacup going steady now?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CPS
    Now we are confusing people who try to pound the piss out of the ball with people that actually have the proper mechanics and training. The original point of the thread was putting versus driving... not short game... not course management. I'm sorry but a PLAYER is also someone who can generate distance without pounding the piss out of the ball. Bad drives (as well as short drives) cost more strokes that bad putts. What cost Ricky Barnes an 8-shot lead at this years US Open? Bad driving... he got nervous and hit some glorious ducks off the tee. Driving is just as mental and requires just as much finesse as putting. And, if someone is having a mental issue they are still going to snap or slice a 3-wood, 5-wood or any other course managed shot.

    And by the way, Zach Johnson is the most boring and uninspiring major champion in long line of future borg-implanted and indoctrinated boring US champions (including the like of Ricky Barnes and Lucas Glover).
    The tee shot is the most important shot. The argument stating "you hit the most shots with your putter" is pointless. It's guaranteed that you'll hit a minimum of 18 putts per round (unless you chip in, which is pretty rare) and it's really more like a minimum of 26 putts. So you need to throw those 26 putts out of the equation. The remaining 1 to 10 putts are what really matter. So really, the only part of putting that truly matters is your ability to get the first putt close enough to the hole to make the second putt. Let's face it, most putts outside of 10 feet do not go in for amateurs.

    If you hit a drive OB you just lost 2 strokes. Into a hazard and it's a minimum of 1 and many times 2. A bad putt does not penalize you. A drive into deep rough or a deep bunker normally leads to a loss of a stroke. One might argue that a bad drive could be made up by great pitching or putting but that is usually not the case. For people who play once or twice a week the driver is what makes the difference over time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by famousdavis
    Are you and indacup going steady now?
    What's the matter big guy? You feeling left out? My bad! Verbal HUG!! There ya go......
    You woudn't be so jealous if you would check your PM.......Tom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    Couldn't agree more with your appraisal of Zach Johnson, but I'll have to disagree with Barnes. He came to Oz a few years ago and was anything but boring. He had a couple of club throwing dummy spits that would put Tiger's antics in the shade (actualy bordered on mental breakdown) and demolished a nearby tree after an errant shot. And word around the traps was he was very popular and with the ladies during his trip. Read this article and tell me Ricky Barnes is boring. The only bad thing is, I actually put some money on him to win that event.

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/Golf/Badt...787019347.html
    Thanks for the link... I stand corrected and will keep a closer eye on him. Maybe he can get caught on camera beating a fan with an umbrella next time.
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    I had a terrible round of golf yesterday, shooting 17 over off the stick, and I can confirm that the really big numbers on my card all came form errant tee shots OB or in hazards. I actually putted pretty well and still had a big score. On the days when I really drive well but putt terribly, i still manage to shoot under my handicap, so personally I can say that poor driving will affect my game moor than poor putting. A good drive sets up everythig for me, and when I bust one down the middle, I am guaranteed a bogey at worse but usually a par or better.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I had a terrible round of golf yesterday, shooting 17 over off the stick, and I can confirm that the really big numbers on my card all came form errant tee shots OB or in hazards. I actually putted pretty well and still had a big score. On the days when I really drive well but putt terribly, i still manage to shoot under my handicap, so personally I can say that poor driving will affect my game moor than poor putting. A good drive sets up everythig for me, and when I bust one down the middle, I am guaranteed a bogey at worse but usually a par or better.
    Nah have you ever heard of a self fullfilling prophesy. Buddy you just got btich slapped by one. my advice in the future is positive always trumps negative. You been touting how important driving is mininmizing the short game, while consistantly driving it okay and boom the first round after starting this thread you blow up. May I suggest you start a thread and poll discussing the virtues of a poor drive and tap in putts for birdies. This will get your driving back on track.

    Duh

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    Quote Originally Posted by lorenzoinoc
    I'm sure nothing you did hadn't already been done by countless Catholic priests.
    Another Italian going to hell... what are the odds? :-)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not a hacker
    I had a terrible round of golf yesterday, shooting 17 over off the stick, and I can confirm that the really big numbers on my card all came form errant tee shots OB or in hazards. I actually putted pretty well and still had a big score. On the days when I really drive well but putt terribly, i still manage to shoot under my handicap, so personally I can say that poor driving will affect my game moor than poor putting. A good drive sets up everythig for me, and when I bust one down the middle, I am guaranteed a bogey at worse but usually a par or better.
    I played today and putted reasonably well. Had one 3 putt. Didn't miss any 4 footers (which are my achillies heel) but only made one 15 footer for birdie. However i drove the ball really well, hit every faiway which gave me the chance for GIR's of which I had 15. I shot 75 without doing anything much with the putter. I shot 3 over without too much effort; just steady, percentage golf. Sorta proves to me the importance of driving well in contributing to a good score.
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    This thread should use Tiger "***** hound" Woods as an example. Drivers suck , irons, short game, especially putting saves the day.

    Thread closed case closed

    GHD

    PS good round OP,
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    Quote Originally Posted by groundhogday
    This thread should use Tiger "***** hound" Woods as an example. Drivers suck , irons, short game, especially putting saves the day.

    Thread closed case closed

    GHD

    PS good round OP,

    I've changed my mind on driver being the most important club. I didn't miss a drive the other day and had a pretty bad round. Something happened to my iron swing where I was releasing too early and I skulled two 100 yard shots over the green. Every other shot was thin and I finally figured it out on the last two holes. I even topped a 3 wood, something I haven't done in probably 5 years.

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    Woah momma way to go famous davis you broke 100 for the first time. congratulation

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    I played today and putted reasonably well. Had one 3 putt. Didn't miss any 4 footers (which are my achillies heel) but only made one 15 footer for birdie. However i drove the ball really well, hit every faiway which gave me the chance for GIR's of which I had 15. I shot 75 without doing anything much with the putter. I shot 3 over without too much effort; just steady, percentage golf. Sorta proves to me the importance of driving well in contributing to a good score.
    Nice round OP.

    Here is my take on this based on recent experience. I shot a career best 74 just prior to Xmas. Two over in the front nine (two bogies) and even on the back nine. I started the back nine par, par, birdie and then went bogie, bogie, bogie and then finished birdie, birdie, par. All three birdies were due to long putts. Several par saves were also due to making long putts and even one bogie was making a 6 footer that would otherwise have been a double. Not one 3 putt. On that day my driving was average to poor. In fact during the past couple of months prior to Xmas I was having a crisis of confidence with the driver and was often resorting to 3 wood during rounds.

    Thankfully I have sorted out my driving and yesterday I was driving well and my ball striking in general was great but the putter was off and I shot a frustrating 82 with several 3 putts and lots of missed 4-5 footers. So for me personally the putter is by far the most important scoring club.
    I chose the road less traveled.

    Now where the f#ck am I?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi Player
    Nice round OP.

    Here is my take on this based on recent experience. I shot a career best 74 just prior to Xmas. Two over in the front nine (two bogies) and even on the back nine. I started the back nine par, par, birdie and then went bogie, bogie, bogie and then finished birdie, birdie, par. All three birdies were due to long putts. Several par saves were also due to making long putts and even one bogie was making a 6 footer that would otherwise have been a double. Not one 3 putt. On that day my driving was average to poor. In fact during the past couple of months prior to Xmas I was having a crisis of confidence with the driver and was often resorting to 3 wood during rounds.

    Thankfully I have sorted out my driving and yesterday I was driving well and my ball striking in general was great but the putter was off and I shot a frustrating 82 with several 3 putts and lots of missed 4-5 footers. So for me personally the putter is by far the most important scoring club.
    I can see your point. I have said before, and still believe, that to regularly score well ALL aspects of the game are important.
    Sinking bombs, especially multiple ones is a pretty rare occurance for me. So I am not going to have many good rounds relying on that. A good putting day for me is no 3 putts and the occasional 1 putt.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldplayer
    Sinking bombs, especially multiple ones is a pretty rare occurance for me.
    Yeah.

    Me too!
    I chose the road less traveled.

    Now where the f#ck am I?

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi Player
    Yeah.

    Me too!
    Bloke I played with today sunk at least 4! He won the comp with 43 points. I managed 3rd. place.
    Well done NAH, your'e thread has ticked over the ton.
    Cobra ZL 9.5 Stock stiff.Sonartec SS 3.5 14*Sonartec HB-001 21* Cally Diablo Forged 4-6 nippons, 2013 x forged 7-pw pxi 5.5 TM rac 50/6 gw. Fourteen MT-28 54 & 58 S400 Daddy Long Legs 35"TM Lethal

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